Author Topic: Stop the Madness!  (Read 3425 times)

Offline Admin Al

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2004, 07:49:23 am »
adam, I think he's being sarcastic!

<wry grin>

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Offline t-rad

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2004, 07:55:25 am »
oops, sorry.  i'll go back to watching this from a distance.  i don't feel like repeating last year's argument.

-a

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2004, 04:49:11 pm »
Climbed standard route on whitehorse yesterday. Perhaps of relevance, but the right hand two pin belay on the upper slabs, believe pitch 6 or 7 (before the final 5.5 optional overlap) consisted of only one pin. It was possible to back it up by placing some gear about 5-6 feet down and tying it together.  

Offline skibum

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2004, 06:54:15 pm »
Last time i checked theft was illegal in all 50 states. It doesn't matter if you want them there or not b/c they are there for the safety of climbers who use them(mainly begginer trad and trad climbers w/o a wide selection of gear). If someone stole the pins w/o permission then it is ILLEGAL. That is what makes me mad, Law Breaking Climbers.

DLottmann

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2004, 08:03:09 pm »
Quote
Climbed standard route on whitehorse yesterday. Perhaps of relevance, but the right hand two pin belay on the upper slabs, believe pitch 6 or 7 (before the final 5.5 optional overlap) consisted of only one pin. It was possible to back it up by placing some gear about 5-6 feet down and tying it together.  


Are you talking about the belay on Lunch Ledge?  Why not use the bolts there?  Assuming they are still there.

DLottmann

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #20 on: April 12, 2004, 08:07:12 pm »
Quote
Last time i checked theft was illegal in all 50 states. It doesn't matter if you want them there or not b/c they are there for the safety of climbers who use them(mainly begginer trad and trad climbers w/o a wide selection of gear). If someone stole the pins w/o permission then it is ILLEGAL. That is what makes me mad, Law Breaking Climbers.


I am not advocating their removal, but it is not "theft" in the legal sense.  It isn't illegal.  Just wrong.  And the climb is just as safe without them.  Not advocating removing pins, simply saying that if you can't protect Funhouse safetly without fixed pins, you should learn how to.

Offline Admin Al

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2004, 08:39:00 pm »
I believe that there are 2 belays on the Lunch Ledge. one is pins & the other bolts.

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Offline Dick_Clark

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #22 on: April 13, 2004, 08:49:37 pm »
Is it just me or is it not the case that most of the people advicating the "cleaning , purification, etc." of climbs from pins and bolts are ragging on about easy trade routes? O. K., you are a total badass because you can cruise thin air and funhose with out clipping decent gear ( that has been being maintained since before most of us ever climbed). I don't here any talk of the pins on the prow offending purists. Don't get up there much do ya. My point is, if you, like me, have not been climbing for a real long time, please let this be a forum for having your opinion known and discussed, rather than your rash actions be reviled and regretted.

Offline rustyrat

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2004, 05:01:14 pm »
Confusing the Thin Air deal with what occured on Upper R and Funhouse is silly, they are two very different things. What is happening on Upper R and Funhouse is indeed madness. Let me remind everyone of a little story.

Long ago a hot shot local, needed a pin to protect his new route. To cheap to buy one he decided to remove one from a moderate route on Cathedral. He was a big tough guy, could never see why anyone needed a pin on such moderate ground, even though it was actually the only possible pro on that section of the climb.

Many years later a newbie climber tried that pitch looked for a peg that was in the guide book, screwed up ,fell and died. It was an ugly ending to a young life, plenty of bloody CPR etc.

Sure he did many things wrong shouldn't have been there maybe, but regardless he's dead now.

Very cool for some nameless a** hole to steal pegs from Upper R - because hey, he didn't need them why should anyone else. These arn't retro pegs these have been there for at least the 20 years I've climbed on cathedral. They are estabished, guided book refered to pieces of tradition.

I just hope our new cool cheap assed hot shot feels good about what he's done, because then at least some one is getting something out of such an obviously idiotic ego driven action - Oh to be such a big puffed up fish in such a small puddle, get a life man.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2004, 05:25:16 pm by rustyrat »

Offline climbhigh

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2004, 06:32:58 pm »
Try reading the guide books for the last years and if you notice the thin air pro is mentioned in them.  What Bayard did was just as bad as who ever took the pins from fun house and refuse, to say it any dfifferent is admitting your ignorance.  I would like to know why these hot shot young climbers waste their time on the lower grade routes, why not take the bolts from a climb in their ability, EGO.  I think if Bayard took the appropriate actions and fixed his hack job it would be less of a sting, but he not only oversteped his bounds but did so in a disgraceful way.

nana

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2004, 10:31:21 pm »
OK, I will try again, on chauvin's website (www.chauvinguides.com/guidebook.htm) route descriptions he talks about on pitch 6 (pitch 7 or 8 of websters) of a 2 fixed pin belay for Standard Route -Whitehorse. There is only one pin there now.

For those of us who are honed disadvantaged, such things are of importance.

On the Lunch ledge there are more fixed belay stations than you know what to do with.

Incidently, besides another party, we were the only ones on the slabs last Sunday. Though is seemed to want to snow for a moment, it stopped and the day was great.

Offline rustyrat

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2004, 08:23:06 am »
In reponse to Climb High's

Try reading the guide books for the last years and if you notice the thin air pro is mentioned in them.

It all depends on how many guide books back you go.....

Thin Air certainly seemed perfectly protectable before the third generation of bolts arrived. Upper R on the other hand is a very different option for a new leader with out the pins, which are mentioned in the guide books prior to the thin air bolts appearing in it.

Offline jdw

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #27 on: April 16, 2004, 08:53:30 am »
In light of the recent liberation/theft/repurposing of pins to the left of the Prow, it made me curious as to whether other areas were affected.  Specifically, another board (neb.com) made a reference to all the pins on the Saigons being pulled, too.  Can anyone confirm?

Offline climbingchimp

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #28 on: April 17, 2004, 02:28:45 pm »
Lunch Pad's pins are all gone.  ...if this is common knowledge, please excuse me . . .
« Last Edit: April 17, 2004, 04:41:15 pm by climbingchimp »

DLottmann

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Re: Stop the Madness!
« Reply #29 on: April 17, 2004, 04:31:52 pm »
Quote
Lunch Ledge's pins are all gone.  ...if this is common knowledge, please excuse me . . .


What?  I climbed Standard Route on Whitehorse today, and as of 12:30 PM the three pins to the right of the bolted belay on Lunch Ledge are STILL THERE.  Why try and spread false info?