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[strandman]

i love jeremy's new book, lot
s of new stuff and great photos... however'

Toe crack- 3 stars ? Please
Reach the Sky- 1 star

Mortal Coils 3 stars

Ah if it's hard and sporty then more stars. I get it.  Armaggedon is the best slab in NE, just because it's serious and hard, it dooesn't get more stars ?? in my book, as good as bachar -yerian in Toulumne. but harder

whatever

sorry J... great book, i;m just in bitchin' mode

[tradmanclimbz]

If you wanted more stars you should have placed enough bolts to keep people off the deck

[Admin Al]

If you wanted more stars you should have placed enough bolts to keep people off the deck

LOL...

[JBrochu]

Toe crack is 3 stars because New England doesn't have very many really good easy routes. It's totally a function of the grade imo. But if he had given it 1 or 2 stars that would have been ok too.

[strandman]

I agree j-- i call it the moby grape effect

protection as a correlation to stars is silly

[tradmanclimbz]

Actually for rock climbs it is not silly with the exceptions of moderate slab climbs and runouts below the grade. The Only way you get stars on a really dangerous rock climb is if you have superstar name recognition. Heck I don't even give my own climbs stars if the gear sucks...    Ice and Alpine is a totally different story.

[radair]

Toe Crack - a splitter 5.7 hand crack without being wide (with that sweet little arete above it), hell yes, 3 stars.

I did an early ascent of Reach for the Sky. My lasting memory is a thin hard move with a questionable peg below my feet. I would agree with just 1 star, which is still a quality route. Something like the Arete, which I thought was scary & hard but had brilliant moves and spectacular position, 3 stars (or 5 or whatever the top end is).

Everyone's opinion is their own, therefore it can't be wrong, can it?

[strandman]

No , opinion can't be wrong.

hey- i placed that peg 20= years ago.. it's bomber. I disargeee on the dangerous/good idea.. Jimmy Surette did some WAY crazy shir bitd and even if the routes don't get repeated, that are still awesome. Tim did the same kind of stuff, but harder in the 90'/000's

just because they are runout and way hard doesn't make them not worthy. i have heard Cecile (hardest route on cathedral ?? is got40' fal potential off the crux-way to go

[pappy]

Actually for rock climbs it is not silly with the exceptions of moderate slab climbs and runouts below the grade. The Only way you get stars on a really dangerous rock climb is if you have superstar name recognition. Heck I don't even give my own climbs stars if the gear sucks...    Ice and Alpine is a totally different story.

I can think of a number of routes in NC that get stars because of the type (lack) of protection at a particularly spectacular position.

[strandman]

Original Route   5.9+ to 11a X whatever you call it.. what a great fucking climb, you may die at any point..including belays.

i have done you Asked for It in tuolumne 2x... a real body burner, you could go 100' off 10b moves...you asked for it said Bachar

He also said" i could give a fuck if you do it or not, but I'll have a ton of respect for you if you do it. i'll even buy you a beer" Good enough for me

[strandman]

Stage fright- no ground up ascent after 25 years,, speaks volumes to me.

[eyebolter]

Strandman, many of the runout routes in New England get few or no ascents, which means that they are covered in lichen, dirt and pine needles.  Hard to give three stars to such a route.

Heck, I did Intimidation 20 years ago and it was like that. I figured it was a great route but dirty and would only get one star in the Rumney guidebook.  I gather that it has been cleaned up since.

Three star rock climbs are just that, rock climbs.  Pine needles, lichen, and dirt hummocks automatically negate the three star rating unless you are the guidebook author and first ascentionist. 

We can all quibble about stars, but the guy perusing the new guidebook doesn't want to have to get out his nut tool to dig the dirt out of a crack on a "three star" route in order to climb it.

[strandman]

i get it.. my main thing was to bust Jery's balls a bit    guidebooks are hard work and controversial.

so many routes in NH are runout and scary- it's the way it is and hopefully always will be, that's why we have Rumney. because  a routes gets overgrown ans dirty doenst; mean it's not good ..shit saigon got WAY dirty and 15 years later it was a classic.

i did perilous Journey a while back in Eldo... in '75 breahers must have shit his pants.. With micro gear it's middling R ..11A  , Should it be changed with a bolt / Fuck No. If Stage fright had fixed gear, it whould so change the route and render Hugh's effort meaningless.

 a noted NH climber at the time said ' if Hugh falls off, he won't break his legs'  Funny, the guy didn't talk well for few days..just sayin'
 

[eyebolter]

Well you could always come back east and clean your babies at least once every year until the next guidebook comes out...

[tradmanclimbz]

We did Flashdance over in the daks about 12 years ago. That thing was supposed to be some kind of megga classic. I doubt anyone had climbed it in years. It was about as dirty as it gets without it being an FA.  It had that cross thingy that mellor used instead of stars and we were  somewhat befuddled. this thing has stars?   Whatever. seems like everyone does Overture  which crosses  Flashdance  and is so much better of a route..