5.9/5.10 Trad Routes for Projecting via Self-Belayed Toprope

[triguy]

What? Bolt a crack just because there are other bolts on the climb? How is that teaching someone to be better prepared for a future climb? A you think that because the leader may not be prepared it is the fault of the first ascentionist and that the climb should be altered for eternity to make it easier for someone to do gound up? WTF?

I seriously hope either my fist cup of coffee has not kicked in or something was lost when you ran this through the translator.

This is an all time low for you.

[sneoh]

personally, you go to a sport cliff, you bring your quick draws... climb on bolt...Oh! it is a crack!!! no bolt. So you turned back to your car, get out the packsack, get out the gear, bring them to the cliff and finally climbed twenty feet of 'trad'. For me, it is not fair. Bolt that crack.

This is an argument which has occurred and will continue to come up at many sport crags; do you bolt a crack or leave the route a mixed one?  Of course opinions and local ethics differ area to area.  Just go with the flow, especially if you are a visitor.  Most guide books do a good job highlighting mixed routes at a predominantly sport crag.

[lucky luke]

Of course opinions and local ethics differ area to area. 

I like the used of that words!!! ethic

If we go to cathedral and there is more people who want to bolt than to trad climb,,,,those bad people begin by fixing ger, bolt anchor and when a sport climber using cam and stoper felt...you point out that it is the fault of trad climber and we must place bolt. you are not fair and respectfull of more than fifty years of history. We most keep the trad activity as much as we most keep park clean of major human's intervention.

Reality is that sport dont train the same things than trad. A driver of an automatic car can be dangerous if he drive a standard car becausse he dont know how to shift the gear. Having a clutch does it means that you are a manual driver?

[tradmanclimbz]

is this ground hog day?

[danf]

...Having a clutch does it means that you are a manual driver?

I guess so.  Just like having a brush in hand means you are a painter at that given moment.  I'm a landscaper by trade and training, but I can work concrete and frame a house if I had to, does that make me a sport climber or a toproper?

[JBro]

[ed_esmond]

so, what happened to the bears?

my neighbor has a picture of a black bear sitting in his "plow truck."  it's an automatic, maybe he can't drive a clutch....

ed

[xcrag_corex]

so, what happened to the bears?

my neighbor has a picture of a black bear sitting in his "plow truck."  it's an automatic, maybe he can't drive a clutch....

ed

Further proof that its a sport bear.

[DLottmann]

personally, you go to a sport cliff, you bring your quick draws... climb on bolt...Oh! it is a crack!!! no bolt. So you turned back to your car, get out the packsack, get out the gear, bring them to the cliff and finally climbed twenty feet of 'trad'. For me, it is not fair. Bolt that crack.

This is an argument which has occurred and will continue to come up at many sport crags; do you bolt a crack or leave the route a mixed one?  Of course opinions and local ethics differ area to area.  Just go with the flow, especially if you are a visitor.  Most guide books do a good job highlighting mixed routes at a predominantly sport crag.

This is an argument that shouldn’t exist IMO. You should NEVER bolt a crack because it is at a predominant sport climbing crag... the idea that the crag developers are somehow responsible for an ill-prepared climber getting hurt because he thought the crack would be bolted is ridiculous...

""There are no fixed rules save those you create for yourself provided you are honest about how you've accomplished something."

...For me, it is not fair. Bolt that crack...

Not fair... right...

[strandman]

Let's say this thread has lost it's way-

Should you ever bolt a bear

Or a Velociraptor

How about pins in Deer

I need a drink

[triguy]

Al needs to lock this thread and end the pain!

[strandman]

I think it should go 30 pages,,,, of complete nonsense

[Admin Al]

Al needs to lock this thread and end the pain!

LOL...

but it's fun...

[tradmanclimbz]

best thing we got going these days w/ no snow/winter.  I Want to see a real trad bear

[sneoh]

Trad, I think Groundhog Day came early!

DMan, we are not talking bolting a predominantly crack climb.  Rather, if there is a short crack section on otherwise a facey sport route, do you put a bolt in rather than have the leader place one or two pieces?  Examples that I can think of right now is Sky Pilot (got to place gear) and Retro Spade (two opposed and fixed nuts the last time I looked) at Rumney.