Author Topic: John Long decks at gym  (Read 4857 times)

Offline JBrochu

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #75 on: December 13, 2012, 12:40:07 AM »
I'm going to have to try that.

I found some of the Goldstone posts where he talks about using the tie-in loop and why he prefers using it over the belay loop in some cases. He linked to an article which I will link to below. He also said this is very common in the UK and it's very strong but it's unusual to see people doing it in the states.

http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=1129

Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
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Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #76 on: December 13, 2012, 06:57:26 AM »
I have known for at least the last decade that crosloading your tie in loop is not good. No cordelette. one doubble length runner for belays. add a shoulder length as needed. Donnini has the fastest belay. Clove hitch a single blue camalot and call it good.

Offline SA

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #77 on: December 13, 2012, 08:47:40 AM »
"Donnini has the fastest belay. Clove hitch a single blue camalot and call it good."

Yes, Donini is very fast, but sometimes, in my opinion, he puts too much faith in a single cam.

Several years ago,  we had to retreat from a climb in the Wind Rivers due to a storm coming in. We were leaving most of the rack  at our high point, intending to return. He set up the anchor, and planned to rap off ONE cam. I popped 2 more in against his objections.

I'll make an attempt to post a picture of the 12 pitch route we were on, plus a picture of Jim.

« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 09:11:26 AM by SA »

Offline JBrochu

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #78 on: December 13, 2012, 08:52:10 AM »
I have known for at least the last decade that crosloading your tie in loop is not good.

Citation?

Every seemingly legit source I've been able to find says it's fine EXCEPT if you use one of those finishes that tucks the tail back into the knot. I use a figure eight with a single fishermans backup which basically makes it bomber.

Edit: out of habit I call my backup knot a "stopper" but I guess it's technically a single fishermans.



 
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 08:55:31 AM by JBrochu »
Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
-bristolpipe

I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
-Stoney Middleton

This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
-Friar Tuck

Offline JBrochu

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #79 on: December 13, 2012, 08:56:46 AM »
Several years ago,  we had to retreat from a climb in the Wind Rivers due to a storm coming in. We were leaving most of the rack  at our high point, intending to return. He set up the anchor, and planned to rap off ONE cam. I popped 2 more in against his objections.

Looks nice!

Why would he object to beefing up the rappel anchor if you were leaving most of the rack at the anchor anyway?  ???

« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 09:01:59 AM by JBrochu »
Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
-bristolpipe

I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
-Stoney Middleton

This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
-Friar Tuck

DLottmann

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #80 on: December 13, 2012, 08:57:09 AM »
... He set up the anchor, and planned to rap off ONE cam. I popped 2 more in against his objections...

"OK, I'll rap first on the 3 pieces, you can clean what you like after I am on the next anchor"

Offline old_school

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #81 on: December 13, 2012, 09:20:24 AM »
I'll make an attempt to post a picture of the 12 pitch route we were on, plus a picture of Jim.

OMFG Steve!!! This looks incredible!! What route is this that you posted? Is this one of yours? I have to get out there!! :o
"Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you will be a mile away from them and you will have their shoes."

Offline old_school

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #82 on: December 13, 2012, 09:32:14 AM »
JBrochu brings up and interesting point with his system there. The Brit's have used that system quite a bit and allows an easy escape of the belay. Here is an interesting video of how it is used. I have played around with it and find that it is pretty cool given its application. Would I use this regularly? No. But that being said, I still see the merit in a system like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B1RIQy1mog
"Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you will be a mile away from them and you will have their shoes."

Offline SA

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #83 on: December 13, 2012, 10:12:26 AM »
old school,

Yes, it is. I did it with John Bouchard in the early 70's.

Offline strandman

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #84 on: December 13, 2012, 10:20:21 AM »
Speaking of minimalists......

I guess JB made an impact, I still carry little gear

Offline old_school

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #85 on: December 13, 2012, 10:26:20 AM »
old school,

Yes, it is. I did it with John Bouchard in the early 70's.

I have to get out there soon! Itching for some long alpine trad climbing!
"Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you will be a mile away from them and you will have their shoes."

Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #86 on: December 13, 2012, 06:13:41 PM »
About crossloading the belay loop.. about the time that the EKD was becomming the rage for rappeling someone got the chop useing an overhand fig eight as a rap knott. the story went they were freaked out about the EKD so why not use  a fig 8 instead. Turns out the fig eight rolls real easy in that configuration and one of them got chopped. I took that info and deducted that clipping directly into your tie in loop could load the fig 8 in the same or simeler direction that caused the aformentioned accident. My own decision based on stories I read on the internet.. YMMV

DLottmann

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #87 on: December 13, 2012, 06:17:24 PM »
I remember that

Offline strandman

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #88 on: December 13, 2012, 06:20:43 PM »
we can discuss this shit all day.. and more . Bouchard was right in "81 and still is  the less the better.

I have never owned a " double " sling , let alone triple  At most I would carry, maybe 4 24" slings.. ever

Maybe if your guiding

There's to much shit in climbing... Cordalettes and such.. use your fucking rope, it's kinda pricey to have to buy more shit ?

FUCK i  thought the AMC was making a comeback   ;)Fucking  mule knot and whatever else they fucking spewed out.. tie off the leader and shit.   
If you gotta tie off the leader, he;s kinda fucked

I did mail Largo last night and asked of he needed any advice  >:(

Offline sneoh

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Re: John Long decks at gym
« Reply #89 on: December 13, 2012, 07:08:23 PM »
I read on the R&I website today of an update Largo gave; he said he got distracted and never finished his knot. And he added that it would not have mattered if it were a Figure-8 or bowline.  I have to agree.  Must have been quite the distraction since both he and his partner missed the double checking part before he climbed.  :(

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