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Author Topic: avalanches  (Read 5489 times)

frik

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #90 on: February 01, 2013, 11:31:33 AM »

Actually lots of points, this has been one of the best trolls of all time....
Good job champ, your work here is done.

I believe it's time to discuss sport, trad, bolting, and thin air... again.
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lucky luke

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #91 on: February 01, 2013, 12:38:25 PM »

I believe it's time to discuss sport, trad, bolting, and thin air... again.

I think that to discuss sport, trad, bolting...we most talk about safety

Knowing when to bail and when to go for it....it is a big part of climbing, hard to master as many aspect most be take in consideration

Avoiding the danger to hike lyon head is not climbing, and doing think as the people won't train for safety is not a discussion
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JBrochu

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #92 on: February 01, 2013, 01:40:05 PM »

Take that frik...

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Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
-bristolpipe

I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
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This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
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triguy

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #93 on: February 01, 2013, 01:52:41 PM »

I think that at ice fest this weekend DMan and LL should dress up in inflatable sumo suits and have at it once and for all.

Collect money at the door and donate the proceeds to the mt washington Avy crew.

 8)
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Ice has two purposes in life: climbing and watering down bad scotch!

JBrochu

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #94 on: February 01, 2013, 01:58:15 PM »

I think that at ice fest this weekend DMan and LL should dress up in inflatable sumo suits and have at it once and for all.



Dman called me, he's up for this and on the way...

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Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
-bristolpipe

I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
-Stoney Middleton

This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
-Friar Tuck

DLottmann

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #95 on: February 01, 2013, 07:07:53 PM »

triguy, I think that is an excellent idea. If Craig will shave his beard I should be able to wrestle Champ. And I LOVE that JBrochu found a sumo wrestler that not only looks like me but is also on skis...... PRICELESS....


PS... Ice didn’t get hit too bad...

My last two days: http://davidlottmann.wordpress.com/2013/02/02/2-day-private-ice-climbing/

Thinking LHMW tomorrow ;)
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JBrochu

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #96 on: March 06, 2013, 02:20:58 PM »

I am learning...but what is the condition to have an ice dams? I always thought that it is when the weather come warmer and the water run under the snow and can not flow down because of an obstruction, call damn. Actually, the condition is going from rain to snow with a decrease of temperature from 30 to zero. I don't think that ice damn will be a problem.


A rapid drop in temperature is one of the common conditions under which ice dams form. Going from rain to snow with a decrease in temps from barely freezing to zero seems like ice dams would very likely.
 

"One way an ice dam can form is under conditions of a rapid temperature drop. The low temperature on the summit of Mount Washington in the previous 24 hours was –19 degrees F. Waterfall ice is formed when water flows over steep terrain in winter. The water that forms the ice is always flowing and constantly forming new ice. When the air temperature drops, water channels freeze up and water begins to pool up behind the ice. This creates hydraulic pressure behind the ice. When the ice dam is disturbed, the pooled water breaks out, often with an explosive force."

Source: http://www.mountwashingtonavalanchecenter.org/search-rescue/incidents-accidents/2000-2001-summaries/

02-18-2001 summary


(I had meant to address this a while ago but I could not find the relevant quote at the time and just happened to come across it recently.)

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Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
-bristolpipe

I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
-Stoney Middleton

This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
-Friar Tuck

lucky luke

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #97 on: March 07, 2013, 10:57:00 AM »

I am learning...but what is the condition to have an ice dams?
When the air temperature drops, water channels freeze up and water begins to pool up behind the ice. This creates hydraulic pressure behind the ice. When the ice dam is disturbed, the pooled water breaks out, often with an explosive force."
Source: http://www.mountwashingtonavalanchecenter.org/search-rescue/incidents-accidents/2000-2001-summaries/
(I had meant to address this a while ago but I could not find the relevant quote at the time and just happened to come across it recently.)

Look at the reference: it is from the avalanche center and I critic them to have an accademic knowledge of the problem, not a pratical knowledge.

Google the words run off and found as much information as you can on: "The draining away of water (or substances carried in it) from the surface of an area of land"

In a previous thread, I talked about the flow of water, the difference between the day and the night. To show some thing, one guy said that it dosen't exist. If I am wrong, I learned some things that can save my life. Wtih that attitude, I can climb and be safer. If you are wrong, you loose your credibility because you don't talk to help other people, you talk to point out that I am wrong. I know that is a point that pissed a lot of you because it is important what the other think. My goal is to show that we can be safer than yesterday by talking of knowledge. If you confront me with the paper of avy center, I will agree that I was wrong for a part of it.

For the damn, it is like waste water sewer. If there is too much water in the same time (rain exceed the capacity of the sewer) there will be an overflow. Any situation creating an overflow will create a damn. An avalanche for example can stop the run off of water and create a damn if the water is trap under the snow/ice. If the water had a place to go, it will create a damn.

In the particular situation of rain, the run off will be hight for the next day or two. So, much a lot of "pipe" will be open and the water won't be trap. As it began to snow, an isolation of the water inside the snow will occur and the water trap inside the snow will flow away. When the run off will dimished, the pipe will stay there, but they will be free of water. It is only when the run off will become higher than the run off will exceed the capacity of the pipe. That it will be dangerous for the climber. A damn, without water, is not dangerous.

But it is true to say that one way that damn can be form is during a rapid drop of temperature and I was wrong. If you go climbing, look for places where the run off can be stop and where the water begin to emerge from the snow above...and avoid the place. Ex. snow pocket can create a damn.
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DLottmann

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #98 on: March 07, 2013, 12:23:21 PM »

I am learning...but what is the condition to have an ice dams?
When the air temperature drops, water channels freeze up and water begins to pool up behind the ice. This creates hydraulic pressure behind the ice. When the ice dam is disturbed, the pooled water breaks out, often with an explosive force."
Source: http://www.mountwashingtonavalanchecenter.org/search-rescue/incidents-accidents/2000-2001-summaries/
(I had meant to address this a while ago but I could not find the relevant quote at the time and just happened to come across it recently.)

Look at the reference: it is from the avalanche center and I critic them to have an accademic knowledge of the problem, not a pratical knowledge.


Yes, what practical knowledge could they have from spending every day of the winter season in the ravines for the last 20+ years. Those close-minded fools.

The whole rest of your post is “academic” in nature... all that gibberish to then say something so simple and not useable like “snow pocket can create a damn”...
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lucky luke

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #99 on: March 07, 2013, 03:06:29 PM »

The whole rest of your post is “academic” in nature... all that gibberish to then say something so simple and not useable like “snow pocket can create a damn”...

Academic: Of or relating to education and scholarship. Go any where and when a young get out of the school he think that he know every things, but he have to learn how to work in the industry.

If you talk about the difference of the day and night, it is a pratical observation that I did, support by theoric knowledge at the watershed level. Canoe is a good place to learn about the variation of water level after a thunderstorm (a R2 can be a R4, and after a day of rain, R2 will be a r3. The comparaison with a sewer, it is very pratical because I don't repeat what they wrote in a book, but gave an idea that a lot of people can understand.

In your particular case, If I am true, you are wrong. That "game" don't help any climber to save his life.

I don't even remember the book that you refer every time you talk about avalanche.

   
« Last Edit: March 07, 2013, 03:16:27 PM by lucky luke »
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DLottmann

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #100 on: March 07, 2013, 03:22:08 PM »

Can you back-up or elaborate on your statement about the snow rangers not having “practical” knowledge?
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kenreville

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #101 on: March 07, 2013, 06:49:55 PM »

Dman- You must stop eating the rancid bait.
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WharfRat

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #102 on: March 07, 2013, 07:12:30 PM »

I think rancid is his thing..

Clearly bait is  :D
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DLottmann

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #103 on: March 07, 2013, 08:51:10 PM »

Dman- You must stop eating the rancid bait.

I really can’t help it. If he says something incorrect I will speak up.

I hope if members feel he is trolling they voice their feelings to Al in a PM. I know there is a lot of people frustrated with his posts, but many do not speak up.

Let Al know.

I would like to seem him gone.
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JakeDatc

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Re: avalanches
« Reply #104 on: March 08, 2013, 01:33:09 AM »

Dman- You must stop eating the rancid bait.

I really can’t help it. If he says something incorrect I will speak up.

I hope if members feel he is trolling they voice their feelings to Al in a PM. I know there is a lot of people frustrated with his posts, but many do not speak up.

Let Al know.

I would like to seem him gone.

Gone?  Why, because he doesn't agree with you?  How petty.

As the self proclaimed avalanche expert on the board, where exactly have you climbed outside of New England?   Do you have experience on other ranges? 

gone because he is rude, disruptive, incoherent and repetitively annoying as hell.  And recently offensive in a thread concerning a fatality of a friend of at least one forum member. 
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 01:36:13 AM by JakeDatc »
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