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Author Topic: Chipping Holds  (Read 401 times)

darwined

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Chipping Holds
« on: February 24, 2013, 08:45:28 AM »
Anybody seen the video of Ivan Greene having at a boulder with a "two pounder" and a chisel? Sheesh! I can't wait to hear his side of the story.   :o
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sneoh

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2013, 09:07:37 AM »
The story incl video can be found at mountainproject.com

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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

strandman

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2013, 09:51:28 AM »
The really shiity thing about this is that ivan was someone who started the Gunks bouldering comeback

sad and disgusting.... the problem is just to hard for him

I doubt the Mohonk will be very pleased
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xcrag_corex

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2013, 01:49:26 PM »
all that techno and dub-step must have gone to his brain. not cool at all.
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-Jeremy Ballou

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danf

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2013, 05:16:18 PM »
According to the posters on the MP thread it happened on state land not the preserve. Still against the rules tho...
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sneoh

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2013, 05:50:57 PM »
John, 99% sure it is not Mohonk P land.  Likely public land but there is also PRIVATE land around there.  Until one can be sure where the said boulder is, our outrage ought to be tempered.  That said, I imagine this is very likely NOT an isolated incident so I can understand some people's outrage.  I just feel sorry (as in feel the need to bring the sport "down" to his level) for him.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 05:55:39 PM by sneoh »
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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

strandman

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2013, 06:46:57 PM »
FUCK'M-- I will defend the 'NO CHIPPED HOLDS FOREVER'   

it's wrong and people who do it SUCK--- wanna go ? let;s go , I have no problem

i would have whupped his ass in front of the camera..

and smiled  8)
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pappy

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2013, 09:55:54 PM »
Quote from: strandman on February 25, 2013, 06:46:57 PM
FUCK'M-- I will defend the 'NO CHIPPED HOLDS FOREVER'   

it's wrong and people who do it SUCK--- wanna go ? let;s go , I have no problem

i would have whupped his ass in front of the camera..

and smiled  8)

Fucking A. Chipping is an act even more inexcusable than retro bolting, which I consider a capital crime. Every generation (a climbing generation being about 7 years or so) thinks that if they can't do something it can't be done, and since the rest of the route or problem is soooo primo it is ok to fix this one little thing so that the masses can enjoy my new mega-classic. Like Robyn used to say, 'After all we're not talking about 5.11 here', but she wanted to 'adjust' things so that the route would go at the top end, you know, .13d. Travis, who was the hotshot out of TN in the late '80s, worked and worked this route at the New before adding a couple of edges to get past 'a totally blank' 6' section, which was subsequently led at .13c, without using the chipped holds. Don't the sportos today warm up on .13c and .13d?
If they chip, break their fingers so that the question of whether they can climb their new masterpiece becomes moot.
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sneoh

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2013, 10:57:29 PM »
Ah, yes, Travisty, the route.  It looks pretty darn thin from the ground.
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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

xcrag_corex

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2013, 05:45:53 PM »
So.....not being someone who does new routes.... what is the line that separates chipping and cleaning?
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darwined

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2013, 05:49:23 PM »
Quote from: xcrag_corex on February 26, 2013, 05:45:53 PM
So.....not being someone who does new routes.... what is the line that separates chipping and cleaning?

Pretty sure it's the two pound sledge hammer.  There's a big difference between trundling a death flake and sculpting with a chisel.
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xcrag_corex

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2013, 05:54:42 PM »
No question in my mind about that. The dudes clearly a scumbag.  It was general question about new routing.
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-Jeremy Ballou

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pappy

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2013, 06:03:56 PM »
Quote from: xcrag_corex on February 26, 2013, 05:54:42 PM
No question in my mind about that. The dudes clearly a scumbag.  It was general question about new routing.

It's a legit question. I would say that if you can pull it off or clean it without using a tool of any type (even a rock), it ain't chipping.
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strandman

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2013, 06:36:23 PM »
that seems fair pappy... Unless it's really bad like a loose flake that's big, then no prying

Like Dry Roasted on Cathedral it was 'cleaned' with a screwdriver on the small flakes- asshole
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M_Sprague

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Re: Chipping Holds
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2013, 07:58:17 PM »
It does get into a gray area, particularly when dealing with more chossy rock, but to lay a boundary, I think I would have to go with intent. If you are thinking "I want to make a hold here" or get rid of this hold there to make the route harder, then it has gone into chipping. If you are doing something that is noticeable to others and pissing off the majority of other climbers, then it is pretty obvious you have gone over the line.

I am not one who rabidly believes any intentional altering of the rock is automatically cause for a public hanging, but our proscribing against it serves us well. The problem is twofold to start with. First are the hacks like Timmy Fairfield who make a mess out of the rock, leaving it obvious that it has been altered, thereby destroying the essence for others of why most of us climb outdoors. Secondly, it is a very slippery slope which can lead to all kinds of stupidity. Even if someone was artful, we could end up with a bunch of routes like gym climbs, all comfortable holds, even difficulty with individuality beaten out of them. A little humility is in order if you think you are wiser and more creative than Mother Nature
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