NEClimbs.com forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Reading the forum on your cell phone? There's an easier way. We've enabled a Tapatalk app that makes browsing the forum a whole lot easier. Check it out in the iPhone or Android store if you don't own it already.

Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 9   Go Down

Author Topic: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday  (Read 3389 times)

Dallas

  • NEClimbs Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2
Logged

Admin Al

  • NEClimbs Administrator
  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6861
  • Climb 'till your forearms turn to jelly!
    • NEClimbs
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2013, 02:34:59 PM »

The news reports all seem to be saying he fell 70'. I would say that the distance from near the cave, all the way down to the tracks would be closer to 200'. I'd think it's darn close to a full rope length, or more.
Logged
Al Hospers
____________________________________
my music
 https://www.facebook.com/BlackMountainRamblers

web hosting, design and software programming:
 http://www.cambersoft.com

ELM

  • NEClimbs Senior Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 322
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2013, 02:41:31 PM »

I would agree AL....could be 300' to the tracks!!
I think it would make sense to have a new litter and cache at the Frankenstein Trestle. Most of the accidents happen within a 1/2 mile radius of the trestle and it's a great central location.
Logged
Ed Matt
" I release my attention: because of you now I am in danger!!! " -Champ

Admin Al

  • NEClimbs Administrator
  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6861
  • Climb 'till your forearms turn to jelly!
    • NEClimbs
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #48 on: March 20, 2013, 12:11:07 AM »

Not a bad idea. Worth mentioning to Rick Wilcox.
Logged
Al Hospers
____________________________________
my music
 https://www.facebook.com/BlackMountainRamblers

web hosting, design and software programming:
 http://www.cambersoft.com

tradmanclimbz

  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3668
  • Nick Goldsmith
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #49 on: March 20, 2013, 09:15:33 AM »

It certainly does not look like a full rope from standing on the tracks?
Logged

DMan

  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3905
    • My Guiding Blog
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #50 on: March 20, 2013, 09:19:57 AM »

The news reports all seem to be saying he fell 70'. I would say that the distance from near the cave, all the way down to the tracks would be closer to 200'. I'd think it's darn close to a full rope length, or more.

This is probably because witnesses would say he “fell 70’ feet”, then slid/bounced down to the tracks. Total fall was probably closer to 170’, but the quote that reached the media was 70’.

It’s about 90-100 feet from the base of Standard down to the tracks.
Logged

tradmanclimbz

  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3668
  • Nick Goldsmith
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #51 on: March 20, 2013, 10:16:31 AM »

A few weeks ago the butt slide down from dracula was insane. Getting ready to climb while some folks were leaveing. I heard a yelp and the guy was at the bottom some how OK. When we left I slid in the fresh snow most of the way down (cautious old guy) but decided to get in the track for the last 30ft. OMG that was fast!
Logged

RCorry

  • NEClimbs Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #52 on: March 20, 2013, 11:12:02 AM »

Is it fair to start the discussion regarding decision making and why this climber decided to solo this route. With all due respect to both the victim and his brother who has joined this thread, this needs to be addressed. Ice climbing is becoming much more popular and it feels like we keep seeing more and more inexperienced climbers taking really foolish risks. Casual falls on lead, standing in the firing line of dangerous hanging ice, soloing shit they probably shouldnt even be leading? This not only places themselves in serious danger, but it also effects all the other climbers around them as was mentioned before.

The comment was made that he was "green" to climbing. How is the justification made to solo Standard as a "green" climber? I know that doesnt clearly explain what his level of ability or experience is, but it should be clear that if someone describes you as "green" , you shouldnt be soloing ice, PERIOD.

Because he couldnt find a partner? What happened to adapting your plans to the day and the circumstances so you leave the mountains to play another day?

Logged

darwined

  • Guest
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #53 on: March 20, 2013, 05:43:33 PM »

Is it fair to start the discussion regarding decision making and why this climber decided to solo this route. With all due respect to both the victim and his brother who has joined this thread, this needs to be addressed. Ice climbing is becoming much more popular and it feels like we keep seeing more and more inexperienced climbers taking really foolish risks. Casual falls on lead, standing in the firing line of dangerous hanging ice, soloing shit they probably shouldnt even be leading? This not only places themselves in serious danger, but it also effects all the other climbers around them as was mentioned before.

The comment was made that he was "green" to climbing. How is the justification made to solo Standard as a "green" climber? I know that doesnt clearly explain what his level of ability or experience is, but it should be clear that if someone describes you as "green" , you shouldnt be soloing ice, PERIOD.

Because he couldnt find a partner? What happened to adapting your plans to the day and the circumstances so you leave the mountains to play another day?

  You're never going to stop people from making poor choices. 
Logged

DMan

  • NEClimbs God
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3905
    • My Guiding Blog
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #54 on: March 20, 2013, 05:53:10 PM »

I would love to hear more from the victim’s brother or the victim but I’m not holding my breath... unfortunately to often than not victims are to embarrassed or in denial to share their thought process after an accident like this... but maybe they will?
Logged

hobbsj

  • NEClimbs Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 141
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #55 on: March 20, 2013, 06:09:22 PM »

Quote
  You're never going to stop people from making poor choices.

That's a bogus statement.  We as climbers fall in to that category to the rest of the world. You don't know this guy's decision making nor the conditions he made those choices in.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 08:00:19 AM by Admin Al »
Logged

darwined

  • Guest
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #56 on: March 20, 2013, 06:27:13 PM »

Quote


 You're never going to stop people from making poor choices.

That's a bogus statement.  We as climbers fall in to that category to the rest of the world. You don't know this guy's decision making nor the conditions he made those choices in.

Dude, the verdict is in on his choice to solo standard route.  Please explain how you could possibly stop humans beings from making poor choices.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 08:00:59 AM by Admin Al »
Logged

pappy

  • NEClimbs Senior Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 258
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #57 on: March 20, 2013, 07:57:18 PM »

Quote


  You're never going to stop people from making poor choices.

That's a bogus statement.  We as climbers fall in to that category to the rest of the world. You don't know this guy's decision making nor the conditions he made those choices in.

Dude, the verdict is in on his choice to solo standard route.  Please explain how you could possibly stop humans beings from making poor choices.

Oh that's easy: We just pass a law. And another one. And another one. And another one....

Whenever I hear a climber virtuously slamming tobacco and soda and extolling the virtues of taxing the crap out of people 'for their own good' I remind them that they will come for us next. I usually get a deer in the headlights look as response.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 08:01:27 AM by Admin Al »
Logged

kenreville

  • NEClimbs Senior Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 377
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #58 on: March 20, 2013, 09:18:07 PM »

Is it fair to start the discussion regarding decision making and why this climber decided to solo this route. With all due respect to both the victim and his brother who has joined this thread, this needs to be addressed. Ice climbing is becoming much more popular and it feels like we keep seeing more and more inexperienced climbers taking really foolish risks. Casual falls on lead, standing in the firing line of dangerous hanging ice, soloing shit they probably shouldnt even be leading? This not only places themselves in serious danger, but it also effects all the other climbers around them as was mentioned before.

The comment was made that he was "green" to climbing. How is the justification made to solo Standard as a "green" climber? I know that doesnt clearly explain what his level of ability or experience is, but it should be clear that if someone describes you as "green" , you shouldnt be soloing ice, PERIOD.

Because he couldnt find a partner? What happened to adapting your plans to the day and the circumstances so you leave the mountains to play another day?

Don't fret about the guy that goes bouncing by. If he takes you out, that's another story. You choose to help him out after his fuckup? That's your choice. Casting judgement after the fact? Way "bogus".
Logged

hobbsj

  • NEClimbs Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 141
Re: Accident on Standard Route on Saturday
« Reply #59 on: March 20, 2013, 09:33:27 PM »


  You're never going to stop people from making poor choices.

That's a bogus statement.  We as climbers fall in to that category to the rest of the world. You don't know this guy's decision making nor the conditions he made those choices in.

Dude, the verdict is in on his choice to solo standard route.  Please explain how you could possibly stop humans beings from making poor choices.
[/quote]

So if Steve House fell on repentance, would it be a poor choice?  Its the freakin mountain.  You can make all the right choices and still get f'd up.  You can make poor choices and escape unscathed.  I've been fortunate enough to go through both of these. Your level of acceptable risk is different than mine.  So because he fell and because of that the jury is in?  Or is it b/c we have guys posting on an online forum about their limited interaction with him.  Not saying they aren't being honest, just that its their perspective on events which may not be representative.  We get enough crap about how climbing is dangerous blah blah blah and how every accident is due to poor choices.  I'm just curious with a comment like that of why your threshold is the one that should designate how good a decision is.  What we do as a hobby is a bad decision to most and everything should be a top-rope with crash-pads.  Maybe dude wasn't in the right mind to be making choices to begin with.  Or maybe just incredibly socially awkward when asking strangers for a favor.  God know I've run across dudes asking for belays who I think are a bit off as well as have had people wonder about me.  Not saying it wasn't bad decision making.  But, you don't know the guys perspective and the events that unfolded after he left the tracks until the plunge.  So don't go branding him until we know what happened or you're no better than the wankers who sit there on news sites complaining about how stupid we are as they eat their double mc-heart-attack. 

Reminds me of what my buddy told me once.  In climbing, what's the difference between bold and bad judgement?  If you make it down alive, you were bold.
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 9   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.176 seconds with 22 queries.