Author Topic: warning  (Read 3725 times)

Offline eyebolter

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Re: warning
« Reply #75 on: August 08, 2013, 08:46:33 PM »
Agreed it is a bad habit Dman, IF you switch belay devices.   I don't.   Lots of people belay like I do, and none of them drop anybody ever.  I don't really care what anybody else does, I just think it is dumb to say something is dangerous when it is plainly not.

And do you really doubt that lawyers had anything to do with this?  Really?
 

DLottmann

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Re: warning
« Reply #76 on: August 08, 2013, 08:52:13 PM »
And do you really doubt that lawyers had anything to do with this?  Really?

You really think a non-climbing lawyer advised Petzl, one of the leading safety industry giants out there, that they better tell people to use a brake hand?

Laywers donít know shit about brake hands. Thatís why so many climbing gyms are forced to use GriGris. GriGris are perceived to be safer by non-climbers.

How about those auto-belayís on some climbing walls? Those things freak me out. I like humans.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2013, 08:53:58 PM by DMan »

Offline hobbsj

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Re: warning
« Reply #77 on: August 08, 2013, 09:05:13 PM »
"Laywers donít know shit about brake hands. Thatís why so many climbing gyms are forced to use GriGris. GriGris are perceived to be safer by non-climbers."

Man,  CYA is in every activity.  And it isn't the lawyers, its the a-holes that f-up and take people to court.  But a prime example to compare the break hand on the gri-gri would be the lawyer tabs on the fork of road bikes.  I have never seen or head of a front wheel pop off.  All those things do is complicate a wheel change when the race is playing out up the road without you.  So, we file them down without a single incident.  If anything, they can make things worse when a wheel being tightened catches on those.  Next thing you know, its too loose when it slides up in the dropout.  But, fork manufactures put them on there to escape liability because they are perceived as safer.  Same difference.

DLottmann

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Re: warning
« Reply #78 on: August 08, 2013, 09:24:22 PM »
What is "CYA"?

Offline kenreville

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Re: warning
« Reply #79 on: August 08, 2013, 09:44:22 PM »
Cover Your Ass.

Offline sneoh

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Re: warning
« Reply #80 on: August 08, 2013, 09:46:59 PM »
Cover Your Ass.

I use my GG like I use an ATC. Brake hand stays whether it is a surprise fall or not.

"How about those auto-belayís on some climbing walls? Those things freak me out. I like humans."
Ha, ha, one more guy who distrusts those damn things.  I down climb the climb when I warm up on routes equipped with them.  In the words of a friend : "I don't trust anything or any person which/who does not understand Take!".


"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

Offline pappy

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Re: warning
« Reply #81 on: August 09, 2013, 06:50:26 AM »

"In the words of a friend : "I don't trust anything or any person which/who does not understand Take!".

I thought the command was "Ohfucktake!!!" That's the one I use anyway.
If you're gonna be stupid, you gotta be tough.

Offline eric8

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Re: warning
« Reply #82 on: August 09, 2013, 01:51:58 PM »
I can say that in general from my experience climbers who use a grigi provide better belays. Softer catches, less of a tentendacy to short rope.  This is probably due to the fact that they are used to sport climbing and so are more used to catching falls, and therefore often more attentive then those who use an atc.  I use a grigi for most multi-pitch trad, with a reverso to belay the second, all belays are auto locking.

In one case, I was partially dropped by an experienced belayer using an atc.  We both sustained minor injuries as a result, her hand getting caught in the atc when she finally caught me.  This would not have happened with a grigi.

Offline DaveR

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Re: warning
« Reply #83 on: August 09, 2013, 05:37:15 PM »
I can say that in general from my experience climbers who use a grigi provide better belays. Softer catches, less of a tentendacy to short rope. 

All of the climbers I know who belay with a gri-gri consistently short rope me when clipping or slam me into the rock with the exception of just a few! They are the only ones who I will let belay me with a gri-gri. There are only 3 on the list.

I use a grigi for most multi-pitch trad, with a reverso to belay the second, all belays are auto locking.

Does "auto locking" mean you would take your hand off the brake end of the rope with a Reverso while bringing up a second?

Offline ELM

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Re: warning
« Reply #84 on: August 09, 2013, 07:14:38 PM »
I can say that in general from my experience climbers who use a grigi provide better belays. Softer catches, less of a tentendacy to short rope. 

All of the climbers I know who belay with a gri-gri consistently short rope me when clipping or slam me into the rock with the exception of just a few! They are the only ones who I will let belay me with a gri-gri. There are only 3 on the list.

I use a grigi for most multi-pitch trad, with a reverso to belay the second, all belays are auto locking.

Does "auto locking" mean you would take your hand off the brake end of the rope with a Reverso while bringing up a second?
    I see tons of people bringing up seconds with Atc's or Reverso's set up in autolock with no hands on the rope except to pull up slack. They are designed to be used this way...still gives me the willies though.
Ed Matt
" I release my attention: because of you now I am in danger!!! " -Champ

DLottmann

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Re: warning
« Reply #85 on: August 09, 2013, 09:05:02 PM »
While you do not need to keep a brake hand on a ATC-Guide or Reverso properly set up you shouldnít use that as excuse to never hold the brake hand. Iíll let go to quickly organize the stack or take my pack off but only momentarily.... if itís going to be for more than a minute Iíll throw a knot in the rope...

EDIT: DaveR, I wouldnít take my hand off during an exam!
« Last Edit: August 09, 2013, 09:06:44 PM by DMan »

Offline sneoh

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Re: warning
« Reply #86 on: August 09, 2013, 11:42:37 PM »
Yeah, willies indeed.  Yikes.

What I have seen is experienced people can get lulled into bad belaying (too much slack, short roping, slamming a falling climber) when using a GG.  Just because a GG makes catching a fall "easier", it does not automatically make one a better belayer!  Still got to pay attention to the leader whether you are using a GG or ATC.   That is my warning :)

"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: warning
« Reply #87 on: August 10, 2013, 06:30:43 AM »
The whole point of the ATC guide is to free up your hands for other tasks like photos, brewing espresso, posting on facebook etc.. 8)

DLottmann

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Re: warning
« Reply #88 on: August 10, 2013, 08:34:01 AM »
The whole point of the ATC guide is to free up your hands for other tasks like photos, brewing espresso, posting on facebook etc.. 8)

LOL yup

Offline DaveR

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Re: warning
« Reply #89 on: August 10, 2013, 11:05:19 AM »
The whole point of the ATC guide is to free up your hands for other tasks like photos, brewing espresso, posting on facebook etc.. 8)

You must climb with a lot of AMC people. ::) ;D