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[M_Sprague]

Maybe a better question would be "How can beginners, intermediates and experts improve their route reading skills?" Obviously lots of onsite climbing is paramount, but coaches have developed specific exercises.

[Admin Al]

Maybe a better question would be "How can beginners, intermediates and experts improve their route reading skills?" Obviously lots of onsite climbing is paramount, but coaches have developed specific exercises.

+

So what are those exercises?

[M_Sprague]

Visualization for one. Visualize as much of the climbing sequence as you can, through your whole body, imagining your balance and weight shifts. I think down climbing helps you become aware of your whole body more, especially keeping your weight on your feet, which give you more of a repertoire for visualizing. 30 minute workouts (climbing for 30 minutes straight without a rest on terrain that is easy enough that you don't get pumped out) on lots of different routes builds your repertoire of movement quickly too. If you have done the move 50 times already you can visualize a similar one more easily.

[David_G48]

Yes, Mr. Sprague reps are good for you young folks who can remember things. Two days in a row I once did the same route at City of Rocks and commented on how excellent it was when someone told me that I had said the same thing about the same route the day before. I think that could count as 2 onsights. Back to your original statement....remind me again what we were talking about.

[M_Sprague]

I have no idea.

[lucky luke]

Maybe a better question would be "How can beginners, intermediates and experts improve their route reading skills?" Obviously lots of onsite climbing is paramount, but coaches have developed specific exercises.

+

So what are those exercises?

All, I didn't even say that sport climber try a route and fall many times isn't it???

 

[lucky luke]

Visualization for one. [...} If you have done the move 50 times already you can visualize a similar one more easily.

As I like safety, I won't say how I can visualize a move in an overhang where the hold his out of sight?

Oh! I rap from the top so I can visualize the hold and told every body that I onsight the move from bottom up as bottom down didn't count!!!

More seriously, knowing our technique is important. To do an overhang, you have to know how to do a "retablissement" (in French forget the name in English). So, you can anticipate the move, take a look and try the move after for the good or the bad. One can say that a good aid courses will help here because pro can be as hard to place as in an A-3. Reading the route is also reading where to place pro where you can and need it.

Serious climber know that when you repeat a move 50 times, you know how to make that move. if you go in a gym and move one hold of six inches at each try for one technique, you will know the limit of your skill to do that technique.

I can be very strong at crack climbing and weak at face. In a route finding situation, the decision to try a crack or a face will change all the technique...and the rating. Today a lot of climber change the rating of a route because they try to adapt the route to there technique and they don't adapt there route finding to the rock.

 

 

[DLottmann]

Only guidebook authors "change the rating".

So it felt harder to you because you are better at <insert> (face/crack/slab/sport/trad/overhangs) etc... doesn't change the grade.

I am convinced there is no one else in the world who thinks about these things as deeply as you do Champ/LL.

M_Sprague's comments about visualization are useful and relevant...

The rest of this thread just proves we all have way too much free time on our hands...

[sneoh]

As I like safety, I won't say how I can visualize a move in an overhang where the hold is out of sight?

This where experience, practice, visualization, and confidence all come into play. 
If you are not in an FA situation and if the route is 5.9 G/PG rated, you know there has to be good holds to place gear from and to make upward progress.  So you get a good piece in, suck it up, look for holds intelligently, and move upward.  Again, none of this should be epiphany to anyone. I feel silly for even typing it out.

[DGoguen]

To do an overhang, you have to know how to do a "retablissement" (in French forget the name in English).

In English it's restoration or recovery.
I assume you mean go up check it out, down climb, shake out and give it another go.
Around here, assumptions are dangerous. Ha

[lucky luke]

To do an overhang, you have to know how to do a "retablissement" (in French forget the name in English).

In English it's restoration or recovery.
I assume you mean go up check it out, down climb, shake out and give it another go.
Around here, assumptions are dangerous. Ha

No DG,  it is not recovery. It is when you take a look with your hand to find good hold over the overhang, find some thing, throw your leg on the edge of the roof, turn your body over the overhang and push with the lower leg and try to find a rest. Moby grape roof, third pitch I think, is an example of that. More spectacular is dolomite wall...but I avoided the roof to climb on the right side. I had carpal tunel problem at those time. Not use very often.

[OldEric]

To do an overhang, you have to know how to do a "retablissement" (in French forget the name in English).

In English it's restoration or recovery.
I assume you mean go up check it out, down climb, shake out and give it another go.
Around here, assumptions are dangerous. Ha

No DG,  it is not recovery. It is when you take a look with your hand to find good hold over the overhang, find some thing, throw your leg on the edge of the roof, turn your body over the overhang and push with the lower leg and try to find a rest. Moby grape roof, third pitch I think, is an example of that. More spectacular is dolomite wall...but I avoided the roof to climb on the right side. I had carpal tunel problem at those time. Not use very often.

retable (= mantle)

[DGoguen]

No DG,  it is not recovery. It is when you take a look with your hand to find good hold over the overhang, find some thing, throw your leg on the edge of the roof, turn your body over the overhang and push with the lower leg and try to find a rest.

O.K. We'll go with number 4

masculine noun
1. [de paix] restoring ⇒ Le gouvernement a donné la priorité au rétablissement de la paix dans la région. The government has given priority to restoring peace in the region.
2. [de personne] recovery
3.(gymnastics) pull-up
4. It is when you take a look with your hand to find good hold over the overhang, find some thing, throw your leg on the edge of the roof, turn your body over the overhang and push with the lower leg and try to find a rest.

[lucky luke]

retable (= mantle)

Yes mantle.

Here an expert example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpeylGfmkW4

a lot of them are easier.

Dave: you know now why I don't translate my text with a computer.

[JakeDatc]

Dave: you know now why I don't translate my text with a computer.

What do we use to translate your gibberish?  (charabia)