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Author Topic: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14  (Read 1607 times)

lucky luke

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2014, 09:25:52 PM »

How far is too far when it comes to runouts on ice?  Is it entirely about comfort level?

I think so... I climbed Repentance with George Hurley today. he placed his first piece, cam, about 12' up, then he ran it out about 20' to his next screw.

tweklve feet, I think it is just under the first crux and, twenty feet, when the crack narrow? look like experience climber, not climbing for the first time this season.

But I like the idea that you look at the ice and decide before if the ice is good or bad and where you place the protection. I saw a lot of people, not saying that the women dit it, who climb and, when they are in trouble,...try to place a pro in "catastrophe". Doing that, you loose power and confidence. Any beta to avoid that situation?

In the second accident, I don't know if he place a protection or if he take a long whipper. One of my friend fall there and he lost one of his ice axe long time ago. To broke and hanckel, is it possible that the rope was too thight and that the guy came back to the wall too fast. Falling in a route with pratically 90 degree ice, it is surprising.
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DLottmann

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2014, 02:03:35 PM »

...try to place a pro in "catastrophe". Doing that, you loose power and confidence. Any beta to avoid that situation?
...

Yes, don't climb above your skill level. If you are freaking out placing gear you are in over your head...

I really prefer to climb ice purely with no hangs, but a recent partner demonstrated how if he is a bit pumped he has no issues clipping a solid tool placement to slow his mind down for a minute... while I prefer staying free, clipping a tool is way cooler than falling on ice, so who am I to judge this technique? If I find myself sketched out I'll swallow my pride and do whatever I can to not fall, but I'll also recognize I need to come back and do the climb again in better form...
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lucky luke

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2014, 11:20:16 PM »

...try to place a pro in "catastrophe". Doing that, you loose power and confidence. Any beta to avoid that situation?
...

Yes, don't climb above your skill level. If you are freaking out placing gear you are in over your head...

For me, freaking out could be for two reason, or you climb over your head, or you just place the pro in the harder move. At that place, a fall means that you fall in the worse position. So, I use to do regularly a theoric exercise to evaluate where I am going to fall and what protection I get. When you have a wall of twenty feet, you need one close to the topout to avoid a ground fall, so the pro most be at least at fifteen feet from the ground because of the rope elongation. if you place a pro at your head level,five feet, and climb...you are going to be at ten feet from the pro that you place at fifteen or...maybe less? The harness was not at five feet from the ground. So, you will hit the ledge any way. One pro is easier than two? What is the best??
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DLottmann

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2014, 01:17:04 PM »

Every situation is different, but one thing stays the same:

Falling while leading moderate ice is NOT cool...

Show of hands, how many people here have ever taken a leader fall on anything easier than 4+? Add years leading and current comfort level... you know, this would make an interesting poll... don't answer here, let's take this to a poll topic I will start now...
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bogpetre

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2014, 10:20:13 PM »

I was around when the fall at texaco happened, and although I didn't see the fall itself I did get a look at the route.  It seemed like a 3, maybe a 4 at worst, and seemed like one of the shorter routes around (<50'). 

My own thoughts at the time were that the it seemed like one of the easier routes around on the surface, but after top roping it later I got the impression it was in worse condition than any of the other routes in the area.  Very aerated and brittle.  I don't know whether or not this contributed to the fall at all.
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lucky luke

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2014, 10:58:16 AM »

Every situation is different, but one thing stays the same:

Falling while leading moderate ice is NOT cool...

You are right. Many of the best climber do hard think and fall on easy ground. I practically felt in shoestring (not that I am best climber), and there was an accident this year, I certainly don't appreciate someone you underline how easy it is and stupid I am to had fall.

Still I will appreciate why she felt because it is knowledge, and knowledge is not stupid. 
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tmbirdsall

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #21 on: April 02, 2014, 05:08:33 PM »

I'm the person who fell off the ice at Texaco on January 25th.  I've been climbing for 5-6 seasons.  I've been seconding from my first season and started leading last (2013) season; leading grades 3-4 ice.  I've lead these ampitheater climbs before.  It was steep but I was comfortable on the climb.  The weather had been very cold for the previous week and the ice was super hard and for whatever reason I couldn't get the screw started, got pumped out and fell.  It took about an hour to get me down and out to the other side of the foot bridge and then Littleton Hospital was only another 20 minutes away.
Needless to say, I fractured off the neck of my right talus and had surgery a couple of days later.  I'm still non-weight bearing and have my next set of x-rays May 5th.  I expect a full recovery and plan on getting back out and climbing again next season. 
No one wants to fall.  It sucks, and every day out is different.  Once again, I wouldn't have been leading it if I was in the least bit uncomfortable.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2014, 06:27:10 PM by tmbirdsall »
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tmbirdsall

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #22 on: April 02, 2014, 05:09:17 PM »

I am incredibly thankful for those who were there who got me out safely.
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lucky luke

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #23 on: April 03, 2014, 01:15:15 AM »

I'm the person who fell off the ice at Texaco on January 25th.  I've been climbing for 5-6 seasons.  I've been seconding from my first season and started leading last (2013) season; leading grades 3-4 ice.  I've lead these ampitheater climbs before.  It was steep but I was comfortable on the climb.  The weather had been very cold for the previous week and the ice was super hard and for whatever reason I couldn't get the screw started, got pumped out and fell.  It took about an hour to get me down and out to the other side of the foot bridge and then Littleton Hospital was only another 20 minutes away.
Needless to say, I fractured off the neck of my right talus and had surgery a couple of days later.  I'm still non-weight bearing and have my next set of x-rays May 5th.  I expect a full recovery and plan on getting back out and climbing again next season. 
No one wants to fall.  It sucks, and every day out is different.  Once again, I wouldn't have been leading it if I was in the least bit uncomfortable.

thanks

hope full recovery
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Admin Al

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Re: Leader fall in Texaco Amphitheater on 1/25/14
« Reply #24 on: April 03, 2014, 06:51:52 AM »

I am incredibly thankful for those who were there who got me out safely.

Glad that there were good people there to help get you out promptly. Sound as if you're going to be OK, with a slow recovery. A fall from low on the route, where you have little or no protection it potentially the worst as ground fall is more likely. I hope your recovery goes well...

PS if you want to write up your own report for AIMAM that would be appreciated. You can email me directly via al at neclimbs dot com.
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