Author Topic: standard route at white horse  (Read 14991 times)

Offline lucky luke

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standard route at white horse
« on: August 10, 2015, 04:34:19 AM »
At the top of the pitch five, just after the lunch ledge, we belay at a three.  If you look carefully at it, you will see that there is no bark on the root of the tree at the place where we put our feet to belay. Furthermore, a lot of climber use the three as an anchor to rap down the cliff. People who will keep a small paper for recycling, doesn't see that when they rap they cut the barn of the tree and kill it slowly. In fact, there was a bigger three there before and it was kill by bad practice.

Here it is not to place bolt to save the tree, but just to be careful to protect the environment. When you rap the sling move and cut slowly the bark. the effect on the tree is that it can "pump" water from his root to bring it to his leaf. When you cut the barn you stop the ascension of water by gravity in the bark.

If you have some interest in protection of the environment, use the tree as a back up and make the anchor father in the wood behind. Never rapt as the movement of the rope is not good for the tree.   

Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2015, 05:45:04 AM »
Drill baby drill ;)

strandman

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2015, 08:50:50 AM »
Warren Harding-" who put that tree next to my perfectly good bolt ?"

Offline kenreville

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2015, 11:08:16 AM »
At the top of the pitch five, just after the lunch ledge, we belay at a three.  If you look carefully at it, you will see that there is no bark on the root of the tree at the place where we put our feet to belay. Furthermore, a lot of climber use the three as an anchor to rap down the cliff. People who will keep a small paper for recycling, doesn't see that when they rap they cut the barn of the tree and kill it slowly. In fact, there was a bigger three there before and it was kill by bad practice.

Here it is not to place bolt to save the tree, but just to be careful to protect the environment. When you rap the sling move and cut slowly the bark. the effect on the tree is that it can "pump" water from his root to bring it to his leaf. When you cut the barn you stop the ascension of water by gravity in the bark. So are you suggesting leaving a sling and biner or two behind at every tree rap? Rather than place a fixed bolt anchor? 

If you have some interest in protection of the environment, use the tree as a back up and make the anchor father in the wood behind. Never rapt as the movement of the rope is not good for the tree.
If your issue is that using a tree to rap off slowly kills the tree, how is moving your tree anchor "farther in the wood behind" a solution at all?

Offline lucky luke

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2015, 11:50:11 AM »
So are you suggesting leaving a sling and biner or two behind at every tree rap? Rather than place a fixed bolt anchor? 
If your issue is that using a tree to rap off slowly kills the tree, how is moving your tree anchor "farther in the wood behind" a solution at all?

I climb in remote area in Quebec and many of us use a three to anchor our second. The three was solid and was there for ever.

But some people had bad practice. They girth hitch the tree or rap directly on the bark without using sling. In few month, a year maximum, the tree that saw thousand of climber suddenly died after twenty or so rap.

In mountaineering freedom of the hill, they understand the effect of erosion and people on the life of the rock. It was the time of the pitons scars on the rock and protection of nature. Our older climbers have to fight, as I did today, again people who just want to use the land for there own purpose, without thinking at the next generation, and who abandon the place when they saw how bad it is.

Lunch ledge on standard is going to fall in a far future. If we care about our practice, it can't last many more years. For us and the next generation, I think that it is in the spirit of trad climbing to be careful. If you are good enough to climb the hardiest pitch...Instead of saying the route is done I rapt down to escape the wild ...Just go to the top and take time to look how beautiful is the nature and lucky to have so clean place just aside the town.     

strandman

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2015, 04:57:27 PM »
When i read you LL..I think maybe i should have just jumped at Trinite and ended itall

Offline NEAlpineStart

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2015, 05:24:42 PM »
There is a huge difference between;

1) Rapping with your rope around the tree

and

2) Rapping with your rope through a sling that is tied around a tree.

I think most climbers have understood this for the last 20+ years. The beauty of the particular tree in question, is a wise belayer will anchor to it and hang out below the tree on the rock slab (not the roots) and provide a better belay/visibility to their partner, especially at the crux.

That tree will outlast most of us.

"Moving your anchor farther in the woods" is silly. I'd rather you just anchor off the tree and keep your party moving, as 3 parties are waiting for you to get your belayer moving.

Offline The other tomcat

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2015, 07:09:39 PM »
The proper thing to do is leave a new-ish Dyneema sling and a Helium biner each time you rappel, anywhere...

The Petzl Attache is also ethically acceptable. Please no knotted slings, have plenty from BackintheDay.

Bolt lives matter!
« Last Edit: August 10, 2015, 07:32:44 PM by The other tomcat »
Tom Stryker

Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2015, 08:08:30 PM »
In actuality it is not the sling arround the tree that kills it. it's all the people stepping on the roots while anchored to the tree.

Offline NEAlpineStart

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2015, 09:00:28 PM »
Tom, Nick... I think we all just fell for another classic LL post. Let's keep it going.

In fact, there was a bigger three there before and it was kill by bad practice.

Do you remember it? I've only been climbing that route for 15 years but I don't remember another tree there. There is also no sign of a previous tree (unlike Bombardment). I think you made this part up to gain emphasis to your point.


Offline kenreville

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2015, 09:45:19 PM »
LL kinda makes up many things (in his mind) as he rambles along. That's for sure.  ???

Offline DaveR

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2015, 11:32:36 PM »
I guess truck drivers have a lot of down time to think up crazy shit!

pickle

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2015, 01:15:44 PM »
I've been visiting this site for a couple years now and have found a lot of great information and I appreciate all of the people that contribute meaningful replies to good questions. My question to you lucky luke is how much shit is stuffed in your keyboard that literally every time you make a post on this website it takes me at least three times reading through your entire post to even remotely have any kind of clue what the hell you are talking about. It was my understanding that barns are places you keep livestock, farm supplies, workshops etc. etc. I guess its the outer layers of trees as well. I guess you learn something new everyday. Also I've used trees to rap on occasion to the disgust of ll but maybe I'm just a little to new to multi pitch climbing but what's a three is it some kind of new mechanical anchor or something?

Offline JBro

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2015, 01:30:19 PM »
We need to make a lucky luke bingo card.

freedom of the hills
hole = hold
barn = bark
cotton
moderate is the new low
three = tree

Anything else?
Have a quiche, now, or maybe a tort.  You deserve it!
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I like to keep things simple, even if it's faaaken painful and miserable.
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This is grain, which any fool can eat, but for which the Lord intended a more divine means of consumption.
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pickle

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Re: standard route at white horse
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2015, 01:41:08 PM »
It's not its when I said the outer layer of the tree, I guess my English typing ability is just as piss poor as lucky's . For real though like I said I'm kind of new to multi pitch and I'm wondering what an anchor father is? I'm just trying to learn as much as I can from him.