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Author Topic: Ice tool suggestions  (Read 304 times)

RossGoddard

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2004, 05:04:47 PM »

yeah, the broken grivel tool is true.  I went out with a guy (Bill?)from ADk rock and river, and he told me about a time he was on roaring brook falls?, and his Grivel machine broke at the head.  he said he nearly soiled himself, and had to do some really dicey climbing until he could throw an anchor in.  He told the story wayyyyy more exciting than i can.
anyway, I have quarks and bent shaft shrikes.  like em both, and am either getting headless hooks or fusions this winter for a leashless geddup.  I demoed it a bunch last winter, and im sold on it for a lot of stuff.  Look inbto the hooks, so you can have the best of both worlds
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"It doesn't matter whether we climb leashless, leashed, or with steak knives in each hand. What matters is getting the door early on a cold day..."
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Admin Al

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2004, 05:54:27 PM »

i agre that the headless hooks are quite nice. i used them one day on Unicorn last winter and was suitably impressed. it was in fragile and overhanging conditions and they did a great job hooking as well as swinging. being able to replace the bent shaft with a curved one for the mountains is a nice feature. they actually swing well too.

I was talking with one of the sales people at a local store the other day. he was saying that the hook was his fave tool. he showed me how he could hang his elbow over the tool & rest really easily. it was a neat trick & actually looked pretty neat.

Al
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Tim

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2004, 05:45:18 PM »

Sorry, I'm getting in on this one a little late.  
I have climbed with the same pair of cobras since they first came out.  I've racked up over 60 days a year for the past 6 years with them.  Mostly between grade 4 and M8, and they haven't broken yet.
They have lead nearly every route at Frankenstien and on Washington.  They have also accompanied me on FA's and Long difficult stuff in the Bolivian Andes.  One of the best tools I've ever used!
There were some breaking problems with the CF Black Profit when they first came out, but they were recalled and I haven't heard of any cobra failures.  
My other tools are Ergo's.  Great tool!  I think a lot of you would be surprised to see how many top-end climbers are getting on alpine routes with Leashless tools.  
Last year my roommate had Vipers and for the life of me, I couldn't get them to stick on the first swing.  It made me look like this...  >:(  He didn't like them either.  And just maybe, you bought them on Consignment at IME! 8)
Here is the real-deal!  Anyone out there who is thinking about buying tools!  BD, Grivel, and Charlet haven't changed their pick design in years and you will always be able to find new picks!  
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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2004, 07:14:36 PM »

I saw the Petzl Ergo DVD last year that was floating around. it was really pretty neat. towards the end it showed some hot-shit French dudes climbing Polar Circus using their Ergo's. I guess that the idea was that they felt secure enough with them to climb a major alpine route using them. frankli I think that this is just plain dumb. these guys had a film team with them. if they dropped a tool there was someone around to pass them another one. if I am out there in an alpine setting believe me I want a leash on that tool. no ifs, ands or buts! that's one reason why I took my Cobra's to Pinnacle. Tim's right about how good they are! that said for Frankenstein & other stuff around here I love the leashless tools.

just my 2 centavos...

Al
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tradmanclimbz

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2004, 06:00:20 PM »

Those french dudes were beyond sick and soo casual placeing a screw. just toss the tool over your shoulder and crank the screw in. It looked so easy I tried the over the shoulder trick while scrambling up to deer leap to rockclimb this spring. i promptly dropped the tool into an iced up cave. I had to slither down into the cave , delicately reeeaaach down and grasp the tool before it totaly dissapeared into the depths. I then had to chimny up an iced up slot with no poons and 1 tool. pretty interesting ::) I do the over the shoulder thing quite a bit walking arround but feel way better climbing if i place the tool FIRMLY in the ice when placeing a screw. I also find that i sometimes grab the tool for a rest right after i get the screw in , just before clip a draw to it and pull the rope up. those frenchies did not need to worry about resting 8)
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DLottmann

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2004, 08:33:11 PM »

is this rad Ergo media available online somewhere???  Sounds like something I would like to watch...
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tradmanclimbz

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2004, 08:11:05 AM »

I got mine free with a subscription to one of the climbing mags. i thought it was way better than the plastic climbing BD promo.
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Tim

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2004, 02:39:08 PM »

I seriously feel like the only situation in which I would drop a leashless tool is the same as when I might drop a leashed tool.  While placing or removing an ice screw, and accidentally bumping it on the up-swing.  
The future of all forms of climbing is taking what is possible "roadside" and applying it in the mountains.  There are some pretty rad things one can do with a leashess tool that would be even more rad above 6000 meters!
Some of the big-mountain leashless climbing I've seen is done with a bungy-sort of teather coming from the harness and attached to the spike of each tool.  It allows you the freedom and moblility of leashless, without the outcome of a dropped tool.
In all actuality, if you drop a tool, the protocol is the same as if you dropped any other piece of essential gear, you retreat.
P.S. it helps if you hook your tool over the soulder of the hand that is hanging onto the "set" ice tool.  But I'm not too sold on it myself, I still usually set them both in the ice.   I like having two tools set in the ice above me while placing a screw, it allows me to re-position myself when I start getting pumped.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2004, 02:40:29 PM by Tim »
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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2004, 04:09:28 PM »

what I like to do leashless is to swap hands on a single tool & shake out. since I never had my leashes really tight to begin with, getting pumped really wasn't a problem.

Al
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tradmanclimbz

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Re: Ice tool suggestions
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2004, 04:34:05 PM »

Not sure i am sold on teathering the tool to my body or harness. we allways did that in the old days and it can create some heinous clusters. I am most concerned with dropping a tool when i get a tool stuck and am trying to free it. in an alpine enviornment a tool could be lost durring a slide or floundering decent. what would have been a routine self arrest might end up being the loss of a tool. I am allways more concerned with the snow sections of a grade 3 solo than the ice sections. the ice is easy enough to cimb but the snow could slide or you might get a curtian of ice with snow under it break away. easy terrain moveing fast. a small slide could result in a lost tool.  so esentualy i guess i am trying to say that floundering arround in deep snow with an unleashed tool is begging to give some lucky hiker spring booty.
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