Author Topic: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited  (Read 875 times)

Offline markvnh

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PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« on: July 06, 2017, 08:25:18 am »
Just a bit of info - climbed Hugo's Horror Revisisted yesterday. The top anchor could use all the sun bleached tat cut off and replaced. As it was I cut one of my alpine draws and added fresh to it. More important the third belay anchor / second rap anchor is not equalized for raps. My partner rapped first and you're essentially weighting the top right bolt which under load was wiggling quite a bit. Under no load it seemed tight. If someone goes up I'd at least bring something to tighten which may do the trick - if not it should be better equalized. No pics but it's got quick links and rings that just don't "match" to equalize when the rope is threaded.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2017, 10:27:29 am by markvnh »

Offline Admin Al

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2017, 01:39:49 pm »
totally agree with all that. you can read what I thought in this week's Report. I also mentioned it to Jon Sykes. I traversed from that anchor over right to the Space Time anchor. I didn't have any spare sling/webbing with me. I also thought one of the hangers was loose. it would be better if it had ring hangers.

as for the lower anchor, it has some screw links that aren't actually even. why the bolts aren't straight I don't understand. at the least what there should be is some chain so you can equalize the load.

http://www.neclimbs.com/wmr_pix/20170706/Willard_rope.jpg
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Offline NEAlpineStart

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2017, 05:17:48 pm »
http://www.neclimbs.com/wmr_pix/20170706/Willard_rope.jpg

Al that looks like a Flat Overhand Bend with the tails tucked through the right rap ring... how did that happen and was there any purpose to it? I've never seen the tails threaded through like that....

Offline markvnh

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2017, 08:59:49 pm »
Al,

When I read your your report it was very ironic you mentioned the tat and your rope pic was of the un-equalized rap station!

Mark

Offline Jeff

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2017, 09:55:22 am »
http://www.neclimbs.com/wmr_pix/20170706/Willard_rope.jpg

Al that looks like a Flat Overhand Bend with the tails tucked through the right rap ring... how did that happen and was there any purpose to it? I've never seen the tails threaded through like that....

Dave, I believe that in Al's report he mentioned that they first pulled the wrong rope; therefore I believe that the knot started to pull through the ring (looks like one of those old style rolled aluminum rings which should be replaced when proper length chains are added), leaving the tails still through the ring. Probably a good thing as it might have been a bigger problem if the knot and tails had completely pulled through the ring before they pulled down on the purple rope.  ::)

Offline NEAlpineStart

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2017, 01:02:54 pm »
Ah, that explains that! I always forget which to pull so I almost always clip a draw to the pull side before leaving the station...

Offline Admin Al

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2017, 11:54:10 am »
Dave, I believe that in Al's report he mentioned that they first pulled the wrong rope; therefore I believe that the knot started to pull through the ring (looks like one of those old style rolled aluminum rings which should be replaced when proper length chains are added), leaving the tails still through the ring. Probably a good thing as it might have been a bigger problem if the knot and tails had completely pulled through the ring before they pulled down on the purple rope.  ::)

yup, that is correct Jeff. this all happened because my bud said to pull on the wrong end! needless to say he had to prussic up to fix it! and yes, that old ring needs to be replaced. it doesn't belong there. if this had been chains, it never would have happened. [sigh]
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Offline Admin Al

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2017, 11:57:32 am »
When I read your your report it was very ironic you mentioned the tat and your rope pic was of the un-equalized rap station!

Mark

I was talking about 2 different rap stations. the tat was on the one at the top. IMNSHO it's a mess and should be cleared. it would be great if there were ring hangers on it.

the picture was of the one below the top one and it's the one where we pulled the wrong end of the rope and the knot pulled THROUGH the ring! I have very skinny ropes and that's probably how that happened.

I don't know why those bolts were placed at an angle. the rock looks just fine straight across from either bolt. go figure.
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Offline NEAlpineStart

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2017, 03:14:43 pm »
I don't know why those bolts were placed at an angle. the rock looks just fine straight across from either bolt.

I'm no expert on placing fixed anchors but I will say I prefer either level bolts placed 10-12 inches apart or vertically like the last anchor on Rapid Transit... that anchor is quite unique isn't it?

Offline Admin Al

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2017, 09:16:19 pm »
that anchor is quite unique isn't it?

I'm sure there is a story...
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Offline tradmanclimbz

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2017, 09:21:11 pm »
RTFM  proveideing the rock is good the  actual specs for most wedge bolts  call for them to be placed 10X the diamater of the hole apart or about 3" for a 3/8th inch hole. I like to go about 6 in apart in good solid stone. farther apart twists the  hangers and the rope.

Offline M_Sprague

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2017, 10:08:10 pm »
I don't know why those bolts were placed at an angle. the rock looks just fine straight across from either bolt.

I'm no expert on placing fixed anchors but I will say I prefer either level bolts placed 10-12 inches apart or vertically like the last anchor on Rapid Transit... that anchor is quite unique isn't it?

In good, solid rock, for horizontal placements, you really don't need to go so far apart.  It just makes it so you need giant chains to lesson the vector and not twist your rope so badly. I usually spread my pinky and thumb on my hand as far as I can and use that as the distance. Unless it is for rock quality, angled bolt placements don't make a lot of sense to me (unless they are almost vertical and you are giving a little room for the hardware) 

Though I have usually been partial to horizontal placements, vertical anchor placements have some benefits in certain situations. I go with horizontal since I like the way you can slap 2 quickdraws on if you  need to set up a TR and  you have slightly more wiggle room at the anchor.
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Offline Jeff

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2017, 08:43:19 am »
Hugo's Horror: We climbed it yesterday, equipped to solve some of the above mentioned anchor problems. We were a rope of three, and due to "child pick up" responsibilities, the third ( who had the pack with the chain links, wrenches, etc) had to rap off after 2 pitches to get home in time for the pick up, so the only improvement we could make was to cut all the "tat" off the top anchor, leaving just the dyneema "alpine draw" material left as mentioned by markvnh in the original post. We did as Al H did and climbed to the better ring anchors of Space Time Continuum about 20 feet right and 6 feet higher to make our first rappel. As mentioned, our friend with the gear pack has every intention of going back up soon to "make things right" but for now the top anchor is less than ideal and since it was so easy to avoid using it, that's what we did!

The anchor at the top of the 3rd pitch, as Al already discussed, is also much less than ideal; we were initially equipped to make that better as well but didn't remember until the gear pack was 350 feet below us ::). Senior moments!!  In Al's photo where the rap rope partially pulled through the ring, you can see that the ring is one of the old rolled aluminum ones; I wish people would stop using those cheap things on established routes! I have certainly carried them with extra sling material in the mountains for emergency use, but they have NO PLACE on popular routes with fixed bolted anchors.

BTW yesterday was a fabulous day to have all of the Willard cliff to ourselves!! Sunshine, blue skies and a nice cool breeze once we were on the 2nd pitch! Definitely a "Fifty Center" in local parlance! ;D 8) Jeff Lea
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Offline bubbalee

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Re: PSA - Hugo's Horror Revisited
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2017, 01:00:32 am »
Yes there is . Initially there were only hangers with equalized cordalette. I thought so few people would actually climb the route and the one's who did could deal with my poor placement of bolts so be it. Later on someone replaced the hangers with rings. I'm glad someone is willing to rectify the situation. I live in Colorado now so it's not on my list of things to do I am glad people are enjoying it. Please do whatever needs to be done to make it more enjoyable
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