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General => Injuries, Medical & Training => Topic started by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 09:19:33 am

Title: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 09:19:33 am
I returned from a full day yesterday on Willard (very cold), and after my feet started thawing out I discovered a throb in my right big toe. I didn't pay much attention to it and chalked it up to the thaw process. After about an hour, the pain grew worse and it was time to peel off the socks and check out the damage. The toenail is bright purple and black and vey sensitive to the touch...tons of pressure under the nail. I had to bag out on my partner this morning due to the discomfort. I have never had an issue with my boots and am on my third season with the new Nepals.

Am I going to lose the nail, is there a way to treat this? Any suggestions???  :-\

Thanks
Grammy
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: little lil on February 07, 2010, 09:56:19 am
Ouch!  I'm not a doc and asking your PCP is prob the best way to get professional input but here's what I know about this.  My BF had the very same thing happening to him (also with the Nepals).  There is no real treatment but tough it out and wait for the new nail to grow.  Make sure to keep the nail nice and clean to avoid any infections on top of it. 
How did that happen?  Do you think your nails were a little too long?  Anyways, have a speedy recovery!
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 10:26:55 am
  Make sure to keep the nail nice and clean to avoid any infections on top of it. 
How did that happen?  Do you think your nails were a little too long?  Anyways, have a speedy recovery!

Hey Lil!

Yes..I think that the nail was too long ( :-[ ) but I suppose that coupled with the cold...I sealed my fate. I was thinking about drilling a hole in the nail with a drill bit or knife end to aleviate the pressure would feel good...but not sure if that is a good idea with infection, etc...

I still may do it though...
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: little lil on February 07, 2010, 11:02:35 am
you can burn a hole thru the nail (with a cautery) and drain the blood.  but rather go and see your PCP for that. 
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 11:10:25 am
you can burn a hole thru the nail (with a cautery) and drain the blood.  but rather go and see your PCP for that. 

Yah...I should probably see my PCP. I have both my young daughters today...so I will have to wait to go this week. The pressure is really uncomfortable!!! And I am suoposed to go out this wednesday to climb too! Nuts.... :P
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 07, 2010, 12:03:20 pm
grab a bottle, put on the Big Game and when Peyton starts cryin'- rip your nail off with a BD Cobra ! Tape up- drink more
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 01:05:17 pm
grab a bottle, put on the Big Game and when Peyton starts cryin'- rip your nail off with a BD Cobra ! Tape up- drink more

Hahahahaah....best advice all day. I will eat the toe nail if the Colts win... :-X
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 07, 2010, 02:29:40 pm
wITH HOT SAUCE
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 02:36:42 pm
A little Louisiana Cajun "Jum-Toe-Laya"
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: David_G48 on February 07, 2010, 03:27:21 pm
Grammy
I could be wrong but what you describe is the beginning of frost bite under the cuticle. The blood pools and freezes at the surface which will look like bruising(I have seen this before). Depending on how bad it is you can lose the toenail. Be diligent in watching it for a while as it will freeze again and damage more tissue. It takes a while before it will tolerate the cold as well as before and in some cases it remains sensitive for life. Best to get professional advice if you plan to go out soon.
Sorry to here about your mishap and pain.

David
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 04:46:55 pm
Hey there Dave!

You could be right, but the feet never got that cold...a little numb, but certainly not as bed as I have felt before. We were stuck on a small belay ledge for roughly an hour waiting for our third...I may have cut off some circulation to the toes, but I tried to change my stance and position as much as I could. SEems to be purple on the lower right side under the cuticle and almost splits the toe in half lengthwise...(greyish is color). The feels like there is pressure under the nail...hurts to the touch.

Grammy  :-\
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 04:59:09 pm
Just did some research on this subject and found a condition common in long distance runners called "runner's toe". Pretty original..however, the picture looks exactly like my condition:
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2513/3864312601_cd2e11d939.jpg)

Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 07, 2010, 05:48:53 pm
Looks yummy ! A little sauce and maybe some garnish. It's even better when the other toes look like corn chips !!!!
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 06:20:45 pm
 :D

Maybe a little peanut butter and Toe Jam??!!?

Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 07, 2010, 07:50:27 pm
Or TOE CRACK ! I am building an outdoor adobe oven in the spring, I bet toe would be good baked
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 10:10:28 pm
Hey John....plenty of reason to raise a glass tonight!!! Looks like no toenail alla carte tonight!! GO SAINTS!!!!!  :D
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: Jeff on February 07, 2010, 10:43:19 pm
Just before the KEY play of the 4th quarter, my lovely wife Kathy started saying: "C'mon, interception NOW" and lo and behold, a 60yd interception for a Saints TD!!! What a gal!!
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 07, 2010, 10:45:45 pm
Jeff...please thank your psychic wife for us all!
Been getting out on any ice this season?
~g
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 08, 2010, 09:05:24 am
Just before the KEY play of the 4th quarter, my lovely wife Kathy started saying: "C'mon, interception NOW" and lo and behold, a 60yd interception for a Saints TD!!! What a gal!!

But what does Kathy say about the toe ?
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: ELM on February 08, 2010, 09:56:36 am
Ha...nice job. I hope you haven't drilled in yet...because don't. You're inviting infection if you do and you have enough trouble. If you have drilled fill the hole with superglue from a new bottle. It dose'nt sound like frost bite to me because none of the other tissue is involved..or you just could have been lucky. Runners toe is cause by downward pressure to the toe that causes bleeding under the nail. You can also get it from kicking the toes. Boot fit and lace tension etc can make it more likely. I think you're right and you do have "runners toe". For treatment seek out a podaitrist who can drain it for you correctly and prevent infection. You do need to treat this because the pool of old blood is a breeding ground for infection and your bone is right there...not a good spot to get infected. Also once the blood is gone so is most of the pain. For now coat the toe with bacatracin and get to a doc. Good luck !
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 10:21:23 am
Thanks ELM!

Yah...it seems to fit the description of runner's toe and that is how I am treating it. It feels better this morning, I have my shoes off at work today..the tissue surrounding the nail is fine as  you mentioned. Now that the color is consolodating, I can see that it originates from the base of the nail and goes out from there. I have not yet drilled...lol!

I am sure the nail will be gone in a few weeks, but I will keep my eye on it!

Thanks for the advice!
Grammy
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 08, 2010, 11:15:57 am
DRILL IT !!!!!!  I would say prolly not 3/8" I would dig out an old 1/4". But then glue like ELM says.
On second thought maybe a bathook.
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 11:17:54 am
I was thinking more like a 1/2" bit and a "hole-hog" and just getting after it!!! Then I could just stuff a cork in the hole until it heals... ;D
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: Jeff on February 08, 2010, 11:52:32 am
Be sure to countersink any hole you drill-- then fill with plastic wood, and repaint in  your favorite color, or perhaps add decals ::).

Chris, in answer to your question, I've only been out on ice a couple of times so far, both guiding and for fun-- been very busy teaching skiing, but hope to get out more soon. I have thanked Kathy for her coaching of the Saints defense.
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 08, 2010, 12:03:11 pm
How about a KB to split the nail in half ? Shit I'm gettin ready to work on my own toes ! I dug out a small bone chip from my ankle this past summer. It just was too tempting . About 2-3mm but sure seemd bigger when it was in there.
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 12:14:16 pm
All this talk is making me hungry... ;D
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: Mike G on February 08, 2010, 01:54:40 pm
yo Grammy, You got the same exact thing I got about six weeks ago,except I did it to both toes. After about a week the pain will go away and it will just be ugly. A few weeks after that you will feel pressure again and the nail will start to delaminate and seperate at the cuticle. It seems to be no big deal and should not get in the way of climbing, although I found walking in any shoes that crease at the cuticle really hurt. I got mine from a pair of Napals that were to small. Also, I had my Doc look at them and she just laughed and said I was gonna loose the nail. I did find a little Arnica rub helped for the first week. Call me if you want some more info, I hope this helps.    Mike
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 01:56:41 pm
Thanks Mike!
Great seeing you at Cranmore Friday night. Let's get together.
Grammy  ;)
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: ELM on February 08, 2010, 02:15:31 pm
I was thinking of a 1" hole saw...anyway. Do make sure to keep it clean and coat it with Bacatracin or Bactroban 2 times a day; even afthe the nail comes off until it looks good. Remember to buy a nice chain to hang the nail from...I can hear it now: "I lost this nail when I ..."...or maybe have it bronzed. Do they still do that ?
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 02:21:17 pm
Hahahah...I was thinking of glitter and a gold thread as it would be a welcome addition to the Christmas Tree...I wonder if I should run that one by my wife first though... :-\
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 08, 2010, 02:31:17 pm
I think the winner of guess the route should get a bit of your toenail. TOO bad I can't play
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: old_school on February 08, 2010, 02:35:03 pm
I think the winner of guess the route should get a bit of your toenail. TOO bad I can't play

Agreed...It is theirs! I will even soak it in peroxide before handing it over to the winner(s).
Title: Re: Black and Bruised toenail
Post by: strandman on February 08, 2010, 02:43:47 pm
frik got game #1, who will get #2 ??