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General => Ice & Winter Climbing => Topic started by: darwined on January 24, 2013, 08:39:10 am

Title: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: darwined on January 24, 2013, 08:39:10 am
I can't recall paying much attention to the ice the last real cold snap we had.  What sort of ice is usually formed during cold like we have now.  Is the ice still forming at all? Does the water continue flowing when it's this cold or do "the pipes freeze"?  Is there an ideal condition for building ice i.e.  27 degrees, cloudy, light wind, and fifty inches of snowpack?
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: JBro on January 24, 2013, 09:09:47 am
One thing I would certainly be a little wary about is any of the climbs that have a tendency to form water dams. So Damnation Gully and Willey's Slide are two that I would be cautious with. I've also heard some of the big slides in the Daks can also form water dams.

Other than that, I just know frigid temps make for brittle ice. 
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: Gibby on January 24, 2013, 11:35:39 am
I climbed left hand monkey wrench and Hitchock gully and both still had water flowing even with the temps sitting at -1.
Had a blast.
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: DLottmann on January 24, 2013, 12:20:51 pm
Depends on the climb and amount of available free water... ground water will continue to run well below 0 as it is insulated from the crazy cold temps, and will not "freeze instantly" once it's exposed. I've climbed some of my most fun plastic ice in sub-zero conditions. If the climb isn't fed by any ground water ice growth essentially stops during these kinds of temps. The ice will become hard & brittle, and can start to "dry out". Think of the ice in the freezer if you don't cycle through it... no above freezing temps will pretty much halt any growth, where there isn't free flowing ground water...

Some good places to ferret out plastic ice IMO during these conditions:

Silver Cascade (climb close to the waterfalls for best ice)

East Face Slabs, Willard (look for the plastic lines, right next to brittle lines)-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzpVCWPPHoA Not cold that day but SO plastic. Sorry no X position.

Arethusa

Texaco Slab (not reliable IMO, but sometimes)

Streamline (easy grade II)

All I can think of right now...
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: lucky luke on January 24, 2013, 12:45:39 pm
What sort of ice is usually formed during cold like we have now.  Is the ice still forming at all? Does the water continue flowing when it's this cold or do "the pipes freeze"?  Is there an ideal condition for building ice i.e.  27 degrees, cloudy, light wind, and fifty inches of snowpack?

ice climbing by Chouinard is a good references. They describe 7 type of ice. I think that we must think at how the water is forming first and how the ice is form after. In quebec, the flow of the stream is not the same during the day and the night. At night, there is not a lot of water and the flow fill the hole of the ice in the column. During the day, the water can not flow true a small canal, so the water go over the ice and a bigger ice. watherfall is forming. It is very compact and steep

In Ne, the system is a little different. The snow melt at the top of the hill and the water run under the soil to the cliff. So, the water is dripping more than flowing like in a river. This made very nice ice sicle with different shape.

So it is what I think   
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: triguy on January 24, 2013, 01:59:44 pm
Well, Of course the water stops flowing at night! It had a long had day of route building and needs a nap!

Duh!
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: lucky luke on January 25, 2013, 11:41:59 am
In Ne, the system is a little different. The snow melt at the top of the hill and the water run under the soil to the cliff. So, the water is dripping more than flowing like in a river. This made very nice ice sicle with different shape.

Forgeet to say that the dripping stop at night or when the weather is too cold. So, there is not a lot of ice formation actually.

Notice that the way that a couloir like shoestring is form can be a little bit different. It is more the transformation of snow in ice I think, but really not sure.
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: SidleK on January 25, 2013, 06:03:16 pm
The cold kind....
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: ridgerunner on January 27, 2013, 04:25:09 pm
Water ice.
Title: Re: What kind of ice is forming?
Post by: darwined on January 27, 2013, 06:56:41 pm
The cold kind....
Water ice.

This here's my brother Darryl and my other brother Darryl :P ;)