General => Ice & Winter Climbing => Topic started by: hobbsj on February 05, 2013, 08:48:18 AM

Title: merits of festivals, guides, and old farts
Post by: hobbsj on February 05, 2013, 08:48:18 AM
move the argument over here so Al can have his ice fest thread back :-)

Good points in other thread.  I've had good and bad experiences with guides on public land.  In Ouray, there were some d-bags that kept trying to beat the system.  Rules were made to get them to stop hogging anchors, so they found loopholes.  And they made just as much frustration for the general public.  Down in Texas, I asked a guide if I was heading in the right direction to get to one climbing area in a park that was pretty non-descript with a piss-poor guidebook and received a snide remark.  Then there's the dude throwing his guidemanship around butting in to people's conversation and when my buddy and I were gearing up for his first ice lead, telling him to only take 3 screws (first pitch of standard).  I got his point, but not the time or place to play mr superior arguing the merits of weight. I wish I had remembered the name of who he worked for so I could have called them and let them know how their name is being thrown around.  You couple these experiences with large groups that are unruly, using classic lines, and other things, its easy to see why people get tired of guides.

That being said, Craig at IME is an awesome ambassador to the sport and the profession.  Other guides run their programs with much less impact then previously described.  A group I worked with in Texas (I'm in no way saying I guided as some wankers would) found areas with very little travel that were safe and the volume of a group would not be intrusive to others.  Unfortunately, in the same way a small group of unruly drunken streaking climbers can close down an area on private land, the negative guides can shed an unfortunate light on their field.  This makes it easy to see how people can be frustrated with them running a business on public land.
Title: Re: merits of festivals, guides, and old farts
Post by: OldEric on February 05, 2013, 11:15:03 AM
And you can add to the pot with the corollary question about using public lands for private/commercial use - especially where fees are not being paid - permits may/may not be held.  Compare and contrast to ski areas, logging companies...  Venues being subsidized by Joe taxpayer.
Title: Re: merits of festivals, guides, and old farts
Post by: sherpajosh69 on February 05, 2013, 12:43:10 PM

New here on the forum. And would agree with hobbsj about a small percentage of guides I have come into contact with (most of which were not NH based) thinking they were either better than or more entitled than me/us the average climbers who are just looking to get out and set up a TR ( in the appropriate areas) to do some laps and have a safe fun day  ???.

Two weeks ago my wife and I found time to make it up to go climbing, as we are coastal CT dwellers. We did Friday over at Cathedral North End, then Saturday was looking for something out of the way. So we ended up at the Covered bridge flows over on the Kanck. Well needless to say meager pickings and a party had already set up and was climbing. Long story short they turned out to be the nicest people and, without hesitation, invited us to join them and ended up doing laps with them for a couple hours  ;D. And that's the kind of positive energy my wife and I try to bring to the crags with us.

Now if the croweded areas had some of that karma, especially with some of the guides that show up, the weekends would be far less dreadful to get away and go climbing.....