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31
Climbing Gear Q & A / Re: Sheath Slippage?
« Last post by NEAlpineStart on November 28, 2017, 01:31:32 PM »
Props to Backcountry for replacing it. Most retailers would send you to the manufacturer, especially for climbing gear.
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Events & Announcements / 20% Off Lodging For All Ice Festers!
« Last post by MWV_IceFest on November 28, 2017, 01:12:19 PM »
Ice festers! Do you want a warm bed to sleep on during Ice Fest? Yes? Do you want 20% off of your lodging when you come up? Yes? Then don't wait! You don’t want to be that person that has to sleep on the floor somewhere, or in your freezing cold car. Mention you are coming for the 2018 MWV Ice Fest and take advantage of what North Conway Lodging is offering Ice Festers!
Read about how to receive 20% off your lodging from www.northconwaylodging.com on the blog: http://www.mwv-icefest.com/blog/

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Climbing Gear Q & A / Re: Sheath Slippage?
« Last post by Admin Al on November 28, 2017, 08:13:54 AM »
you might want to give Sterling a holler. I would think it's something they would want to look into...
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Climbing Gear Q & A / Re: Sheath Slippage?
« Last post by Jeff on November 27, 2017, 10:54:48 PM »
This used to be quite common (30+years ago), and is the reason for the "sheath slippage test" which is part of the UIAA certification tests, before a rope gains the UIAA ( and CEN) label. I can't remember the exact year that this test was added to label testing, but I do have notes from my work as the American delegate to the UIAA Safety Commission, and could probably find the date. It was certainly much discussed during the 1980s and I believe that the sheath slippage test (say that 10 times quickly) was added in the late 1980s or very early 1990s. I was the delegate from 1978 through 1999. Jeff Lea
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Epics and Accidents / Re: EDK variation Knot slip - climber dies (WA)
« Last post by Jeff on November 27, 2017, 10:45:38 PM »
Hmmmm--"at what point did this name enter into common/mainstream vernacular in the USA?" I'm afraid I can't answer that, other than to say that certainly it was commonly referred to in that manner among many climbers in New England of my acquaintance  who had also climbed in Europe and/or Great Britain prior to 1985. That is not to say I believe that it "had entered into the common vernacular". It was usually used in a jocular fashion, and often directed at those of us who had adopted the Offset Overhand Knot as our knot of choice for joining rappel ropes. I CAN say for certain that the first time I heard it was in Chamonix in the summer of 1982, after descending from the Aiguille de la Blaitière with a British partner, alongside a rope team of French Aspirant Guides, with whom we were sharing rappel anchors. This sharing may seem unusual to some who have climbed in the alps; my fluency in French as a career teacher of the language certainly helped our interaction, as did the fact that I had spent the previous week at ENSA representing the AAC at the meetings of the UIAA Safety Commission. As for citing me, you have my permission, since I have here clearly stated the limited level of my authority on the origins of the name "EDK".  Jeff Lea.
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Epics and Accidents / Re: EDK variation Knot slip - climber dies (WA)
« Last post by agent_smith on November 27, 2017, 06:29:20 PM »
From Jeff:
Quote
This knot was used by French guides in Chamonix in training at ENSA for their IFMGA certifications in the early 1980s, and British climbing friends of mine, who commonly tied their rappel ropes together end to end with either a double fisherman's bend or a retraced figure eight, referred to it by the term EDK.

Thanks for this info.
In order for the 'analysis of offset knots' paper to be updated, we would need to 'authenticate' it by citing your name along with a specific date (as close as possible to the actual date).
Also, we may need to make a distinction between the use of the name 'EDK' in Europe as apposed to its entry into mainstream USA. As you say, the term 'EDK' may already have been the common vernacular in Europe in the 1980's but, at what point did this name enter into common/mainstream vernacular in the USA?
Our research pointed to the 1998 Karen Turk accident as the likely turning point for its mainstream entry into the USA...

We like to get the facts as close to 100% accurate as is humanly possible!

Please post back here in this forum with specific details - and permission to cite you in the paper!
37
Climbing Gear Q & A / Sheath Slippage?
« Last post by ralbert20 on November 27, 2017, 04:58:27 PM »
Anyone here ever had a rope core come away from the sheath? I was rappelling yesterday and today, using a prusik, and my core just... went up inside the rope... Darndest thing! I have seen it do a little like that before, but this is almost 2 feet inside! It was a bit scary rapping down, and the end of the rope was effectively 2 feet shorter. I asked Backcountry about it, and they said it is defective, so sending a new one. I have only used it about 10 days or so this season. Thoughts, other than just defective? It is a Sterling Marathon 10.1, 70m bipattern.
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Epics and Accidents / Re: EDK variation Knot slip - climber dies (WA)
« Last post by Jeff on November 27, 2017, 08:58:43 AM »
An excellent treatise-- I have only one slight disagreement : the author suggests early in his discussion that the term EDK to designate the Offset Overhand Knot originated after an accident in the Tetons in 1998. This knot was used by French guides in Chamonix in training at ENSA for their IFMGA certifications in the early 1980s, and British climbing friends of mine, who commonly tied their rappel ropes together end to end with either a double fisherman's bend or a retraced figure eight, referred to it by the term EDK. As the American delegate on the UIAA Safety Committee at the time, I had several discussions at meetings at ENSA with French guide instructors and learned of testing they had done to support the efficacy and safety of using the Offset Overhand Knot to join ropes for rappels, whether of equal diameters or not. I've used it consistently ever since for this purpose.
      I am impressed by the clarity of this paper and the quality of the photographs to support the written word. It deserves greater dissemination. I hope that its presentation here will contribute to that effect.
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Epics and Accidents / Re: EDK variation Knot slip - climber dies (WA)
« Last post by NEAlpineStart on November 26, 2017, 07:29:55 PM »
This might be of interest...
Link: http://www.paci.com.au/knots.php

Its at #3 in the table.

...

Wow, that is by far the best research I've seen presented on this topic. Thank you for sharing.
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Events & Announcements / Reel rock 12 showing
« Last post by IOMeara on November 26, 2017, 09:32:54 AM »
At Catamount Arts, in St Johnsbury, VT.

December 8 at 5.30 and 8.

http://www.catamountarts.org/shows/details/reel-rock-12

See you there!
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